3 ms·

>discrimination against women of common child-bearing ages [..] is still common in countries where full benefits exist. What you just provided is an argument

>discrimination against women of common child-bearing ages [..] is still common in countries where full benefits exist. What you just provided is an argument for parental leave. Arguably, the benefits are not full if male parents aren't eligible. This benefit shouldn't be defined by gender: - pregnancy-related benefits should be given to people who can get pregnant - parenthood-related benefits should be given to people who have just become parents (guardians of a newborn, etc). Anything other than this is a stop-gap non-solution, with aforementioned negative side effects.

jjeaff 6y ago
Even with equal paternity leave, I think we all know that it will be used at a much lower rate than maternity leave. And so will employers. It will still be much riskier to hire young women than men if turnover is costly.
- romwell 6y ago
  > I think we all know that it will be used at a much lower rate It's a circular argument, since the main reason men aren't taking time off work to devote to parenting is the absence of such a leave. The reality is that if you provide the leave, everyone will use it. (I work for a company that provides one, though a rather short one). Ideally, the law will be written such that it's not an either-or scenario, and both parents could take the leave consecutively should they choose to (e.g. eligibility for a 6-month leave starting within 6 months of becoming a new parent). And this will make it much harder for companies to discriminate, as it spreads the risks out. Old men can (and do) father children too.
  - curryst 6y ago
    > It's a circular argument, since the main reason men aren't taking time off work to devote to parenting is the absence of such a leave. This is not true. Germany introduced paid paternity leave, and the rates that men use it is still far lower than the rates of maternity leave usage. [1] Other countries might differ, Google wasn't providing me very good results for paternity vs maternity leave usage. [1] https://www.jstor.org/stable/43488388?seq=1 https://www.jstor.org/stable/43488388?seq=1
  - jjeaff 6y ago
    Uh, no, men on average just prefer to work rather than stay home with children. It's not a good thing, imo, but it is just the nature of man.

jjeaff 6y ago

Even with equal paternity leave, I think we all know that it will be used at a much lower rate than maternity leave. And so will employers. It will still be much riskier to hire young women than men if turnover is costly.

romwell 6y ago
> I think we all know that it will be used at a much lower rate It's a circular argument, since the main reason men aren't taking time off work to devote to parenting is the absence of such a leave. The reality is that if you provide the leave, everyone will use it. (I work for a company that provides one, though a rather short one). Ideally, the law will be written such that it's not an either-or scenario, and both parents could take the leave consecutively should they choose to (e.g. eligibility for a 6-month leave starting within 6 months of becoming a new parent). And this will make it much harder for companies to discriminate, as it spreads the risks out. Old men can (and do) father children too.
- curryst 6y ago
  > It's a circular argument, since the main reason men aren't taking time off work to devote to parenting is the absence of such a leave. This is not true. Germany introduced paid paternity leave, and the rates that men use it is still far lower than the rates of maternity leave usage. [1] Other countries might differ, Google wasn't providing me very good results for paternity vs maternity leave usage. [1] https://www.jstor.org/stable/43488388?seq=1 https://www.jstor.org/stable/43488388?seq=1
- jjeaff 6y ago
  Uh, no, men on average just prefer to work rather than stay home with children. It's not a good thing, imo, but it is just the nature of man.