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These phones are primarily about user-freedom, privacy and my ability to do whatever I want with a device that I've purchased, without restrictions imposed by t

These phones are primarily about user-freedom, privacy and my ability to do whatever I want with a device that I've purchased, without restrictions imposed by the OEM. Also, honest question; What do you actually 'use' the latest specs for? These Android/iOS phones are basically all about media consumption, something that has been sufficiently performant for years. You have great hardware, but no software to take real advantage of it. On the other hand, the Linux phones can do so much more on the software side that if they do become successful enough for a second/third... generation with more powerful hardware, it would be much more noticeable than a paper spec bump.

Sebb767 6y ago
> Also, honest question; What do you actually 'use' the latest specs for? Browsing, chatting, navigating and some smaller task. Don't get me wrong, the hardware specs aren't _bad_ and 3G are okay now, but this phone costs as much as all three smartphones I've owned combined and I don't think this will be enough 5+ years in the future, which would by my expected lifespan of this device. Adding to that are the singular speaker and, by todays standard, rather weak camera offering. Again, don't get me wrong: I'd love to buy one of those and support their (absolutely great!) cause. It's simply hard to justify the investment, when 700$ are a lot to me.
- j-james 6y ago
  > 3G are okay now Is it really? AT&T and Verizon, two of the largest mobile data conglomerates in the US, have stated their intentions to shut down 3G service in favor of 5G by February 2021 and December 2020 respectively. https://techblog.comsoc.org/2019/02/22/att-to-shut-down-3g-network-in-2022-verizon-at-end-of-2019/ https://techblog.comsoc.org/2019/02/22/att-to-shut-down-3g-n... https://stopthecap.com/2019/08/01/verizon-delays-shutdown-of-3g-cdma-network-until-the-end-of-2020/ https://stopthecap.com/2019/08/01/verizon-delays-shutdown-of...
  - est31 6y ago
    I think that quote refers to the 3 gigabytes of RAM of the Librem 5 that was mentioned higher up in the chain, not the 3G wireless technology: > But you pay 750$ for a 3GB quad core phone Both Librem 5 and the Pinephone support LTE, although no 5G. You are entirely right that phones which don't support LTE will have major usability regressions very soon so when you buy an older model phone you should really watch out to buy LTE capable ones.
    - j-james 6y ago
      Ah, you're right. D'oh! And it looks like both the Pinephone and the Librem 5 support various LTE bands.
wlesieutre 6y ago
> What do you actually 'use' the latest specs for? Increasingly inefficient consumer software! If everyone else were stuck on old hardware it might stop being a problem, but when you're lagging behind everyone else's hardware you're going to notice it.
pmontra 6y ago
Basically I'm using Firefox, K9 for email, WhatsApp and Telegram to chat with friends, OSMAnd to plan and record bicycle tracks. Phone and camera. Plus mandatory banking apps or I won't be able to do home banking. If I buy a Linux phone I'd have to keep using my Android phone probably as my primary device. And I've been using Ubuntu laptops as my only working devices since 2009 so I'd love to use an Ubuntu phone. Unfortunately it lacks at least half of the apps I need.
- zozbot234 6y ago
  The one app among those you list that will always need a stock Android install is your home banking app. Everything else is either open (including Telegram) or will most likely be runnable in Anbox, which is a high priority for all Linux-on-mobile projects.
  - pmontra 6y ago
    I didn't knew about Anbox. From their FAQ at https://anbox.io/ https://anbox.io/ > The initial proof-of-concept was done on an Ubuntu Touch based device. Since then Anbox has evolved quite a bit, making desktop devices its main development focus. However, recent experiments show that Anbox still runs fine (with a few tweaks and lifted confinement because of older kernel versions) on mobile devices based on Ubuntu Touch. and the link to Ubuntu Touch is > 410: Page deleted. Ubuntu for mobile is no longer supported as we all know. I guess other companies could be working to make Anbox run on their hardware but I'm not expecting anything in a short time. However I could use Anbox on my desktop for a few apps.
- michaelmrose 6y ago
  Does your bank have a web interface?
  - zhte415 6y ago
    A lot of 'challenger banks' do not have a web interface, they're app only.
  - 6y ago
pjmlp 6y ago
Any Android phone can do so much more on the software side. One just needs to treat them as Java based OS that happens to allow native code for high performance 3D graphics, real time audio and integration of C and C++ libraries.
- AsyncAwait 6y ago
  Can they? You cannot reasonably run any mainstream compilers, editors etc. on Android phones. Nor can you develop Android apps on them, (without something like Termux), nor do a gazillion other things you can do on your PC. They're at best crippled pocket computers, whereas something like the PinePhone runs mainline Linux and can run KDE Plasma/GNOME etc. Does Android have more simple podcast apps and the like? Sure. But Android's well over a decade old, while mainline Linux on phones is just getting started.
  - pjmlp 6y ago
    Sure you can, provided you treat them as a Java based OS, as mentioned. If anything fails, you are free to implement your own. GLSL editor https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.id11688025.majorassignment&hl=de https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.id11688025... C# development environment https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.radinc.csharpshell&hl=en_US https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.radinc.csh... Python development environment, https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=ru.iiec.pydroid3&hl=en_US https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=ru.iiec.pydroi... Java and C++ development environment https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.aide.ui&hl=de https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.aide.ui&hl... Terminal like app https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.csgroup.terminal&hl=en_US https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.csgroup.te... Just because one cannot use GNU/Linux command line it doesn't make it less usable. My aging Asus travel netbook is most likely going to be the last hardware I deploy GNU/Linux on.
    - AsyncAwait 6y ago
      > provided you treat them as a Java based OS This topic is about Termux, an app that aims to provide a Linux environment on Android. I can treat it as a "Java-based OS", but then I don't get the benefits of real Linux so am not sure what the advantage is. My dumb phone was also "a Java based OS", iOS is just an "ObjC/Swift based OS" etc. The only thing this mindset does is to ignore the restrictions by giving into them and am honestly not sure why would one do that. > Just because one cannot use GNU/Linux command line it doesn't make it less usable. Sure it does, this very topic is about an app that does precisely that. If one doesn't need that, they didn't need Termux and thus of course this whole topic does not apply to them.

Sebb767 6y ago

> Also, honest question; What do you actually 'use' the latest specs for? Browsing, chatting, navigating and some smaller task. Don't get me wrong, the hardware specs aren't _bad_ and 3G are okay now, but this phone costs as much as all three smartphones I've owned combined and I don't think this will be enough 5+ years in the future, which would by my expected lifespan of this device. Adding to that are the singular speaker and, by todays standard, rather weak camera offering. Again, don't get me wrong: I'd love to buy one of those and support their (absolutely great!) cause. It's simply hard to justify the investment, when 700$ are a lot to me.

j-james 6y ago
> 3G are okay now Is it really? AT&T and Verizon, two of the largest mobile data conglomerates in the US, have stated their intentions to shut down 3G service in favor of 5G by February 2021 and December 2020 respectively. https://techblog.comsoc.org/2019/02/22/att-to-shut-down-3g-network-in-2022-verizon-at-end-of-2019/ https://techblog.comsoc.org/2019/02/22/att-to-shut-down-3g-n... https://stopthecap.com/2019/08/01/verizon-delays-shutdown-of-3g-cdma-network-until-the-end-of-2020/ https://stopthecap.com/2019/08/01/verizon-delays-shutdown-of...
- est31 6y ago
  I think that quote refers to the 3 gigabytes of RAM of the Librem 5 that was mentioned higher up in the chain, not the 3G wireless technology: > But you pay 750$ for a 3GB quad core phone Both Librem 5 and the Pinephone support LTE, although no 5G. You are entirely right that phones which don't support LTE will have major usability regressions very soon so when you buy an older model phone you should really watch out to buy LTE capable ones.
  - j-james 6y ago
    Ah, you're right. D'oh! And it looks like both the Pinephone and the Librem 5 support various LTE bands.

wlesieutre 6y ago

> What do you actually 'use' the latest specs for? Increasingly inefficient consumer software! If everyone else were stuck on old hardware it might stop being a problem, but when you're lagging behind everyone else's hardware you're going to notice it.

pmontra 6y ago

Basically I'm using Firefox, K9 for email, WhatsApp and Telegram to chat with friends, OSMAnd to plan and record bicycle tracks. Phone and camera. Plus mandatory banking apps or I won't be able to do home banking. If I buy a Linux phone I'd have to keep using my Android phone probably as my primary device. And I've been using Ubuntu laptops as my only working devices since 2009 so I'd love to use an Ubuntu phone. Unfortunately it lacks at least half of the apps I need.

zozbot234 6y ago
The one app among those you list that will always need a stock Android install is your home banking app. Everything else is either open (including Telegram) or will most likely be runnable in Anbox, which is a high priority for all Linux-on-mobile projects.
- pmontra 6y ago
  I didn't knew about Anbox. From their FAQ at https://anbox.io/ https://anbox.io/ > The initial proof-of-concept was done on an Ubuntu Touch based device. Since then Anbox has evolved quite a bit, making desktop devices its main development focus. However, recent experiments show that Anbox still runs fine (with a few tweaks and lifted confinement because of older kernel versions) on mobile devices based on Ubuntu Touch. and the link to Ubuntu Touch is > 410: Page deleted. Ubuntu for mobile is no longer supported as we all know. I guess other companies could be working to make Anbox run on their hardware but I'm not expecting anything in a short time. However I could use Anbox on my desktop for a few apps.
michaelmrose 6y ago
Does your bank have a web interface?
- zhte415 6y ago
  A lot of 'challenger banks' do not have a web interface, they're app only.
- 6y ago

pjmlp 6y ago

Any Android phone can do so much more on the software side. One just needs to treat them as Java based OS that happens to allow native code for high performance 3D graphics, real time audio and integration of C and C++ libraries.

AsyncAwait 6y ago
Can they? You cannot reasonably run any mainstream compilers, editors etc. on Android phones. Nor can you develop Android apps on them, (without something like Termux), nor do a gazillion other things you can do on your PC. They're at best crippled pocket computers, whereas something like the PinePhone runs mainline Linux and can run KDE Plasma/GNOME etc. Does Android have more simple podcast apps and the like? Sure. But Android's well over a decade old, while mainline Linux on phones is just getting started.
- pjmlp 6y ago
  Sure you can, provided you treat them as a Java based OS, as mentioned. If anything fails, you are free to implement your own. GLSL editor https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.id11688025.majorassignment&hl=de https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.id11688025... C# development environment https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.radinc.csharpshell&hl=en_US https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.radinc.csh... Python development environment, https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=ru.iiec.pydroid3&hl=en_US https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=ru.iiec.pydroi... Java and C++ development environment https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.aide.ui&hl=de https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.aide.ui&hl... Terminal like app https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.csgroup.terminal&hl=en_US https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.csgroup.te... Just because one cannot use GNU/Linux command line it doesn't make it less usable. My aging Asus travel netbook is most likely going to be the last hardware I deploy GNU/Linux on.
  - AsyncAwait 6y ago
    > provided you treat them as a Java based OS This topic is about Termux, an app that aims to provide a Linux environment on Android. I can treat it as a "Java-based OS", but then I don't get the benefits of real Linux so am not sure what the advantage is. My dumb phone was also "a Java based OS", iOS is just an "ObjC/Swift based OS" etc. The only thing this mindset does is to ignore the restrictions by giving into them and am honestly not sure why would one do that. > Just because one cannot use GNU/Linux command line it doesn't make it less usable. Sure it does, this very topic is about an app that does precisely that. If one doesn't need that, they didn't need Termux and thus of course this whole topic does not apply to them.