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I think you've missed my point here, this goes _way_ further than this specific individual issue. The entire ecosystem is built on a model that turns it into a

I think you've missed my point here, this goes _way_ further than this specific individual issue. The entire ecosystem is built on a model that turns it into a disposable toy and there's no sign that this is going away any time soon. Why do we need hobbyist movements to produce devices that we can actually run real software on and that won't be completely useless as soon as Google decide to update the API?

djsumdog 6y ago
Yea, phones should not be designed to be replaced after 2 years. Phones from 6 years ago would still be plenty powerful if they weren't crippled by Google Services eating more and more resources. Google could use mainline kernels and force manufactures in the OHA to open source all their drivers, maybe even back PostmarketOS to prevent e-waste. You can take an old Pentium 4 laptop and still put modern Linux on it and still use it for some tasks. Good luck trying to do that with any ARM system.
- esotericn 6y ago
  It makes me genuinely really angry that this isn't the case, it has me questioning why I even bother to interact with the development ecosystem when it seems like 90% of the stuff out there is this sort of closed-off 'got mine' fuck-the-environment style thinking. Maybe it's just too much time on HN? Like, how many times does one have to push against the bullshit bootlicker arguments before one just gives up?
- lonelappde 6y ago
  Why does Google owe you this? Write any OS you want. You can use a open source base. That Pentium will cost more in electricity than just buying a new cheap phone.
- zozbot234 6y ago
  The problem is the ARM bespoke-devices ecosystem, not Google. The pre-Android "Linux on mobile" world was far worse wrt. the use of downstream patched kernels. We just didn't care as much, because a kludgy, patched BSP was better than a wholly-closed solution with no source available. Our standards as to what qualifies as "open" have simply become stricter.
- pjmlp 6y ago
  Across Europe pre-paid cards and using phones until they die, are lost or get stolen is the common usage.

djsumdog 6y ago

Yea, phones should not be designed to be replaced after 2 years. Phones from 6 years ago would still be plenty powerful if they weren't crippled by Google Services eating more and more resources. Google could use mainline kernels and force manufactures in the OHA to open source all their drivers, maybe even back PostmarketOS to prevent e-waste. You can take an old Pentium 4 laptop and still put modern Linux on it and still use it for some tasks. Good luck trying to do that with any ARM system.

esotericn 6y ago
It makes me genuinely really angry that this isn't the case, it has me questioning why I even bother to interact with the development ecosystem when it seems like 90% of the stuff out there is this sort of closed-off 'got mine' fuck-the-environment style thinking. Maybe it's just too much time on HN? Like, how many times does one have to push against the bullshit bootlicker arguments before one just gives up?
lonelappde 6y ago
Why does Google owe you this? Write any OS you want. You can use a open source base. That Pentium will cost more in electricity than just buying a new cheap phone.
zozbot234 6y ago
The problem is the ARM bespoke-devices ecosystem, not Google. The pre-Android "Linux on mobile" world was far worse wrt. the use of downstream patched kernels. We just didn't care as much, because a kludgy, patched BSP was better than a wholly-closed solution with no source available. Our standards as to what qualifies as "open" have simply become stricter.
pjmlp 6y ago
Across Europe pre-paid cards and using phones until they die, are lost or get stolen is the common usage.