6 ms·

If this is true, follow the money. HN is run by a Venture Capital firm. What are their incentives? Who does the business have to keep happy?

by gerbal 6y ago

JumpCrisscross 6y ago
> If this is true, follow the money Isn't it more likely it was flagged off the front page by overly-enthusiastic users? I'll also admit that this link, to a support thread, is more compelling than the Ask HN, where half the comments were questioning whether the phenomenon was actually happening.
- jshevek 6y ago
  Yes. I believe some topics get removed by sufficient community flagging alone, no intervention by mods. If true, then this feature can be abused by users with agendas.
- atomashpolskiy 6y ago
  It was not flagged. It was on FP in top 10, then instantly moved to 3rd page without "[flagged]" appearing in the title.
  - JshWright 6y ago
    Flagging has impacts other than the binary "flagged" state.
    - atomashpolskiy 6y ago
      This does not explain an instant move of a submission made 1 hour ago from top 10 to 3rd page, where there are submissions made 1 DAY ago.
      - JshWright 6y ago
        That depends on how many users flagged the post.
        AlchemistCamp 6y ago
        Yes, and within how short of a time span all those flags came in! A post that's regularly being flagged by 0.0X% of logged-in users will have different behavior than one that gets fairly few flags for many hours and then suddenly gets 30 within a five minute period.
- s_y_n_t_a_x 6y ago
  Is that more likely? Should it be that easy for a user to flag an article that's trending so far upward? If it is that easy, maybe we should discuss the flagging system because it gives the ILLUSION that it was taken down because there's a conflict of interest.
  - atomashpolskiy 6y ago
    Please upvote the discussion about flagging: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23223939 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23223939
- foobarian 6y ago
  > Isn't it more likely it was flagged off the front page by overly-enthusiastic users? I for one wouldn't mind knowing if a large fraction of those overly enthusiastic users happened to be coordinated in some way.
- 101404 6y ago
  Wouldn't surprise me if HN was big enough to have a couple of Wumaodangs taking care of it. Well, by now they are probably Liangkuaidangs or something :D edit: looking at the downvotes, I may have triggered a few of them
- mistermann 6y ago
  > Isn't it more likely it was flagged off the front page by overly-enthusiastic users? It's a wild guess either way. Increased transparency like mandatory reason for flagging, and anonymized stats on flagging per userid including not just aggregate numbers, but also flagged post titles (so ideological patterns could be observed per topic) would improve trustworthiness that HN is an impartial platform, and there are no technical limitations in doing this, although it would require a bit of one-time work. It would be interesting to know why we have some stats here, but not others. But unless this greater transparency is provided some day, we will have to run on faith, just as other religious people have faith as the basis of trust in their God of choice. Everyone has faith in their axioms, it just doesn't seem that way, in no small part because the mind tends to not let you think in that manner, even if you try.
techntoke 6y ago
I agree 100%. I've said this before and been threatened with ban by admin/mod. Anytime you go against the agenda, they prevent you for posting comments sometimes in excess of an hour. Then if you reply again and they don't like it you have to wait another hour. Nothing is transparent. They just say, no political discussion, however it only seems to apply towards comments they don't like. It looks like the previous post was flagged, so can't even comment on it.
- barbapapa22 6y ago
  This is a very common bad experience on HN. To me, it must be PG's own character that is being reflected here through a series of mirrors (his disciples). The fish rots from the head down.

If this is true, follow the money. HN is run by a Venture Capital firm. What are their incentives? Who does the business have to keep happy?

by gerbal 6y ago

If this is true, follow the money. HN is run by a Venture Capital firm. What are their incentives? Who does the business have to keep happy?

JumpCrisscross 6y ago

> If this is true, follow the money Isn't it more likely it was flagged off the front page by overly-enthusiastic users? I'll also admit that this link, to a support thread, is more compelling than the Ask HN, where half the comments were questioning whether the phenomenon was actually happening.

jshevek 6y ago
Yes. I believe some topics get removed by sufficient community flagging alone, no intervention by mods. If true, then this feature can be abused by users with agendas.
atomashpolskiy 6y ago
It was not flagged. It was on FP in top 10, then instantly moved to 3rd page without "[flagged]" appearing in the title.
- JshWright 6y ago
  Flagging has impacts other than the binary "flagged" state.
  - atomashpolskiy 6y ago
    This does not explain an instant move of a submission made 1 hour ago from top 10 to 3rd page, where there are submissions made 1 DAY ago.
    - JshWright 6y ago
      That depends on how many users flagged the post.
      - AlchemistCamp 6y ago
        Yes, and within how short of a time span all those flags came in! A post that's regularly being flagged by 0.0X% of logged-in users will have different behavior than one that gets fairly few flags for many hours and then suddenly gets 30 within a five minute period.
s_y_n_t_a_x 6y ago
Is that more likely? Should it be that easy for a user to flag an article that's trending so far upward? If it is that easy, maybe we should discuss the flagging system because it gives the ILLUSION that it was taken down because there's a conflict of interest.
- atomashpolskiy 6y ago
  Please upvote the discussion about flagging: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23223939 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23223939
foobarian 6y ago
> Isn't it more likely it was flagged off the front page by overly-enthusiastic users? I for one wouldn't mind knowing if a large fraction of those overly enthusiastic users happened to be coordinated in some way.
101404 6y ago
Wouldn't surprise me if HN was big enough to have a couple of Wumaodangs taking care of it. Well, by now they are probably Liangkuaidangs or something :D edit: looking at the downvotes, I may have triggered a few of them
mistermann 6y ago
> Isn't it more likely it was flagged off the front page by overly-enthusiastic users? It's a wild guess either way. Increased transparency like mandatory reason for flagging, and anonymized stats on flagging per userid including not just aggregate numbers, but also flagged post titles (so ideological patterns could be observed per topic) would improve trustworthiness that HN is an impartial platform, and there are no technical limitations in doing this, although it would require a bit of one-time work. It would be interesting to know why we have some stats here, but not others. But unless this greater transparency is provided some day, we will have to run on faith, just as other religious people have faith as the basis of trust in their God of choice. Everyone has faith in their axioms, it just doesn't seem that way, in no small part because the mind tends to not let you think in that manner, even if you try.

techntoke 6y ago

I agree 100%. I've said this before and been threatened with ban by admin/mod. Anytime you go against the agenda, they prevent you for posting comments sometimes in excess of an hour. Then if you reply again and they don't like it you have to wait another hour. Nothing is transparent. They just say, no political discussion, however it only seems to apply towards comments they don't like. It looks like the previous post was flagged, so can't even comment on it.

barbapapa22 6y ago
This is a very common bad experience on HN. To me, it must be PG's own character that is being reflected here through a series of mirrors (his disciples). The fish rots from the head down.