4 ms·
I have taken multiple university courses in theoretical physics, in artificial intelligence and in neuroscience, including on the topic of consciousness. I can
by im3w1l 6y ago
I have taken multiple university courses in theoretical physics, in artificial intelligence and in neuroscience, including on the topic of consciousness.
I can directly observe my own consciousness and I can tell that without a doubt it can not be explained by current physics and "complexity". It is completely different in kind.
If you believe that consciousness could arise just from complexity and information processing, then you are frankly mistaken. Whether you lack a consciousness or just the introspective ability to perceive it... or I suppose a knowledge of physics.
Now beyond saying "there is something going on", things quickly become much more difficult. Pan-psychism is a worthwhile avenue to pursue. If there is some phenomenon going on at a macrolevel, then we do expect it to be made up things going on at a microlevel. Some kind of consciousness or proto-consciousness. But am somewhat pessimistic. We don't really know what we are even looking for, so how can we expect to find it?
The attempts to connect wave-function collapse with consciousness are unconvincing to me. It seems basically like tying together two things we don't understand with each other based on... not a lot.
- nsilvestri 6y agoUntil sufficient evidence is provided supporting one way or the other, we do not know whether our current understanding of physics is sufficient for understanding consciousness. You are claiming that it can't, so you now have a burden of proof which you, at the moment, cannot fulfill, and therefore your claim is unjustified.
- im3w1l 6y agoYou are trying to impose an impossible burden on me, and I have no choice but to reject it. I realize that from your point of view, the claim that "I can just feel it" is unsatisfactory, but that really is the essence of it all. If your are sincerely curious meditation and/or drugs may be a path.
- nsilvestri 6y agoIf the burden of proof is impossible to fulfill then you have by definition made an unfalsifiable claim, so your claim can be discarded immediately. "I can just feel it" does not stand as evidence because it is subjective. The only justifiable position you can currently take is "I do not know."
- mercer 6y ago> I have taken multiple university courses in theoretical physics, in artificial intelligence and in neuroscience, including on the topic of consciousness. > ...I can tell that without a doubt... > If you believe...then you are frankly mistaken... I find it very amusing that you present taking 'multiple university courses' as some kind of argument or credential in favor of the following unshaken belief ("without a doubt"). Did any of your courses teach you to doubt things and especially to question things that you are certain about that clearly a lot of other smart people are not?
- im3w1l 6y agoI'm presenting it solely to demonstrate that I'm not a crank or a schizo. The reason for my firm belief is that just as I can look up and see that the sky is blue, look down to see that the grass is green, just as plainly and immediately can I look inwards and see that I'm conscious. Other smart people believing in emergence is easily explained: They can not see what I see.
- mathgenius 6y ago> The attempts to connect wave-function collapse with consciousness are unconvincing to me. It seems basically like tying together two things we don't understand with each other based on... not a lot. This objection seems a bit superficial to me. I think there are plenty of connections. The idea of measurement & observer is baked into quantum physics, hello? But there is a taboo in physics on discussing this stuff. It's nice to see some brave philosophers try to promote panpsychism. I wonder if the physicists will ever become more tolerant of things like this aswell.