10 ms·

Guys hitting on girls is sexual assault now?

cpach 6y ago
No. But if you host on CS in order to make advances towards women, that is creepy behavior and not what the site is intended for. If you want to get laid, use Tinder etc. instead.
- toxik 6y ago
  A girl I met on Tinder used CS to find interesting people and have sex with them. It seems like something men and women have been denying but engaging in for centuries.
- hombre_fatal 6y ago
  I couchsurfed throughout my 20s and it wasn't uncommon to hook up with the host/guest if they were cool. Any app that's geared toward meeting people is going to be like that, regardless of one's puritan views. That's exactly part of the human connection that the site is intended for, like it or not. It's no less of a potential hookup app for women as it is for men. You don't think women want to me interesting guys to fuck? Else women wouldn't even stay with men. They already avoid the guys with bad reviews.
joshvm 6y ago
In some contexts, yes it can be. If that involves, for example, unwanted physical contact. A broader term is harassment, but either is bad. IANAL, and the legal definition may vary by location and situation. See: https://theconversation.com/whats-the-difference-between-sexual-abuse-sexual-assault-sexual-harassment-and-rape-88218 https://theconversation.com/whats-the-difference-between-sex...
- Chris2048 6y ago
  > If that involves, for example, unwanted physical contact Then hitting on someone could be considered murder, if that involves, for example, repeated chest stabbing
namdnay 6y ago
It's about the power dynamic. You're talking about someone who isn't from the area, who doesn't know anyone nearby, and who is supposed to sleep at your place. If you are aggressively flirting with them, they may be forced into the impression that either they sleep with you or they sleep on the street. And that would definitely be assault
- globular-toast 6y ago
  They are women who have chosen to stay at a male stranger's house. Do you think women are completely naïve about how the world works? I've known two women who couch surf and it was de rigueur to have sex with their hosts.
  - hombre_fatal 6y ago
    Lately, there's a weird trend of the Victorian idea that women have no agency, can't think for themselves, and it's up to us to protect those poor little things. Though the person you did respond to did scope their concern to "aggressively flirting" while communicating to a woman that she has to fuck you or get tossed to the street which is obviously not what people mean any time they mention "hitting on women".
    - namdnay 6y ago
      No, lately there's a completely normal trend of taking into account that true consent can only be given without constraint.
  - namdnay 6y ago
    > They are women who have chosen to stay at a male stranger's house They are people who have chosen to stay at a stranger's house > Do you think women are completely naïve about how the world works No, but I don't think they want to have to take every decision based on probability of getting raped > I've known two women who couch surf and it was de rigueur to have sex with their hosts And I know male hosts who had sex with their male visitors. Does that mean that if I couchsurf at a man's flat I should be expecting intercourse for my bed?
galoisgirl 6y ago
If it's not, let the guy just say on his profile that he's looking for something more, and see who comes along.
- globular-toast 6y ago
  Come to think of it why don't men just walk around town with a big sign saying "SEX WANTED" on it? I can't believe nobody has thought of this before.
  - hombre_fatal 6y ago
    I have to wonder how much of this thread is just stereotypically sheltered programmers not realizing that you can have consensual sex without any rigmarole, and that many women are actually looking for it if you're a cool guy that they like, even if they pick you as the house they want to sleep in while traveling, which in my experience often involves some beers with the host. One clue is that it's just focused on men flirting with women that's inappropriate here. All I can gather is that some HNers need to find a new way to low-key flirt with people that doesn't make them(self) think "oh, this must be sexual harassment, this is bad".
    - pg-gadfly 6y ago
      The programmers brain easily gets stuck on a thought loop similar to the _categorical imperative_; in which if something is true, it must be applicable in _all_ circumstances. Human life however is not an infinite array of possibilities, but stay in very specific zones for most of the time. Think about it; exponential behavior would propably be deemed bad for most things out there in code, but if you knew the iterations never peaked above 3, it doesen't apply. Much like in real life, you have concrete real values that never really change, unlike the abstract unknowable problems you're used to dealing with.
    - bambataa 6y ago
      I think people are just pointing out there’s a distinction between: 1) hosting someone with no expectations, hitting it off and consensually getting together 2) hosting someone with the uncommunicated expectation they will sleep with you and pressuring someone alone in your house in a strange country until they consent. People are cool with 1 and not with 2.
zozbot234 6y ago
Hosts hitting on their guests has always been regarded as a gross violation of hospitality. The biblical story of Lot is all about that.
- hombre_fatal 6y ago
  You're making a common mistake seen in these discussions by creating a tautology by defining "hitting on" as always a gross violation of hospitality. Or something that obviously makes someone uncomfortable. Let's not forget that hitting on someone is a continuum that ranges from flirtatious banter that you can enjoy with anyone to one's twisted idea of what hitting on someone entails that makes all their guests uncomfortable. Like asking "wanna fuck?" Yes, hitting on someone in a way that makes them uncomfortable does make them uncomfortable and makes you a bad host. But I worry that you have an unhealthy understanding of flirting if you don't think it's something you or anyone can do without making someone else uncomfortable.
- vorpalhex 6y ago
  > The biblical story of Lot is all about that. The moral flaw "the crowd" made was that it was men attempting to coerce sex from other men. Lot wanted to solve the problem by throwing his virgin daughters into the crowd.. which was apparently a perfectly righteous thing to do. And anyways, that's why you shouldn't get your morality from an ancient book from a very different culture. Please don't throw any of your family members into crowds of rapists, it's not polite.
  - cuspycode 6y ago
    There is a similar story in Judges 19–21, the story about The Levite's Concubine[0]. The main difference is the lack of supernatural elements in this story. Instead the outcome is civil war among the Israelites. [0]. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Levite%27s_Concubine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Levite%27s_Concubine
imnotathrowaway 6y ago
https://youtu.be/-yUafzOXHPE https://youtu.be/-yUafzOXHPE

No. But if you host on CS in order to make advances towards women, that is creepy behavior and not what the site is intended for. If you want to get laid, use Tinder etc. instead.

toxik 6y ago
A girl I met on Tinder used CS to find interesting people and have sex with them. It seems like something men and women have been denying but engaging in for centuries.
hombre_fatal 6y ago
I couchsurfed throughout my 20s and it wasn't uncommon to hook up with the host/guest if they were cool. Any app that's geared toward meeting people is going to be like that, regardless of one's puritan views. That's exactly part of the human connection that the site is intended for, like it or not. It's no less of a potential hookup app for women as it is for men. You don't think women want to me interesting guys to fuck? Else women wouldn't even stay with men. They already avoid the guys with bad reviews.

joshvm 6y ago

In some contexts, yes it can be. If that involves, for example, unwanted physical contact. A broader term is harassment, but either is bad. IANAL, and the legal definition may vary by location and situation. See: https://theconversation.com/whats-the-difference-between-sexual-abuse-sexual-assault-sexual-harassment-and-rape-88218 https://theconversation.com/whats-the-difference-between-sex...

Chris2048 6y ago
> If that involves, for example, unwanted physical contact Then hitting on someone could be considered murder, if that involves, for example, repeated chest stabbing

namdnay 6y ago

It's about the power dynamic. You're talking about someone who isn't from the area, who doesn't know anyone nearby, and who is supposed to sleep at your place. If you are aggressively flirting with them, they may be forced into the impression that either they sleep with you or they sleep on the street. And that would definitely be assault

globular-toast 6y ago
They are women who have chosen to stay at a male stranger's house. Do you think women are completely naïve about how the world works? I've known two women who couch surf and it was de rigueur to have sex with their hosts.
- hombre_fatal 6y ago
  Lately, there's a weird trend of the Victorian idea that women have no agency, can't think for themselves, and it's up to us to protect those poor little things. Though the person you did respond to did scope their concern to "aggressively flirting" while communicating to a woman that she has to fuck you or get tossed to the street which is obviously not what people mean any time they mention "hitting on women".
  - namdnay 6y ago
    No, lately there's a completely normal trend of taking into account that true consent can only be given without constraint.
- namdnay 6y ago
  > They are women who have chosen to stay at a male stranger's house They are people who have chosen to stay at a stranger's house > Do you think women are completely naïve about how the world works No, but I don't think they want to have to take every decision based on probability of getting raped > I've known two women who couch surf and it was de rigueur to have sex with their hosts And I know male hosts who had sex with their male visitors. Does that mean that if I couchsurf at a man's flat I should be expecting intercourse for my bed?

galoisgirl 6y ago

If it's not, let the guy just say on his profile that he's looking for something more, and see who comes along.

globular-toast 6y ago
Come to think of it why don't men just walk around town with a big sign saying "SEX WANTED" on it? I can't believe nobody has thought of this before.
- hombre_fatal 6y ago
  I have to wonder how much of this thread is just stereotypically sheltered programmers not realizing that you can have consensual sex without any rigmarole, and that many women are actually looking for it if you're a cool guy that they like, even if they pick you as the house they want to sleep in while traveling, which in my experience often involves some beers with the host. One clue is that it's just focused on men flirting with women that's inappropriate here. All I can gather is that some HNers need to find a new way to low-key flirt with people that doesn't make them(self) think "oh, this must be sexual harassment, this is bad".
  - pg-gadfly 6y ago
    The programmers brain easily gets stuck on a thought loop similar to the _categorical imperative_; in which if something is true, it must be applicable in _all_ circumstances. Human life however is not an infinite array of possibilities, but stay in very specific zones for most of the time. Think about it; exponential behavior would propably be deemed bad for most things out there in code, but if you knew the iterations never peaked above 3, it doesen't apply. Much like in real life, you have concrete real values that never really change, unlike the abstract unknowable problems you're used to dealing with.
  - bambataa 6y ago
    I think people are just pointing out there’s a distinction between: 1) hosting someone with no expectations, hitting it off and consensually getting together 2) hosting someone with the uncommunicated expectation they will sleep with you and pressuring someone alone in your house in a strange country until they consent. People are cool with 1 and not with 2.

zozbot234 6y ago

Hosts hitting on their guests has always been regarded as a gross violation of hospitality. The biblical story of Lot is all about that.

hombre_fatal 6y ago
You're making a common mistake seen in these discussions by creating a tautology by defining "hitting on" as always a gross violation of hospitality. Or something that obviously makes someone uncomfortable. Let's not forget that hitting on someone is a continuum that ranges from flirtatious banter that you can enjoy with anyone to one's twisted idea of what hitting on someone entails that makes all their guests uncomfortable. Like asking "wanna fuck?" Yes, hitting on someone in a way that makes them uncomfortable does make them uncomfortable and makes you a bad host. But I worry that you have an unhealthy understanding of flirting if you don't think it's something you or anyone can do without making someone else uncomfortable.
vorpalhex 6y ago
> The biblical story of Lot is all about that. The moral flaw "the crowd" made was that it was men attempting to coerce sex from other men. Lot wanted to solve the problem by throwing his virgin daughters into the crowd.. which was apparently a perfectly righteous thing to do. And anyways, that's why you shouldn't get your morality from an ancient book from a very different culture. Please don't throw any of your family members into crowds of rapists, it's not polite.
- cuspycode 6y ago
  There is a similar story in Judges 19–21, the story about The Levite's Concubine[0]. The main difference is the lack of supernatural elements in this story. Instead the outcome is civil war among the Israelites. [0]. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Levite%27s_Concubine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Levite%27s_Concubine

imnotathrowaway 6y ago

https://youtu.be/-yUafzOXHPE https://youtu.be/-yUafzOXHPE