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They may have access to it, but how can they monitize it beyond services directly for the NHS? Is it wrong to assume that just having access to the data does

They may have access to it, but how can they monitize it beyond services directly for the NHS? Is it wrong to assume that just having access to the data does not mean Planatir can use it to benefit parties other than the NHS?

grey-area 6y ago
Sell the data to spy agencies?
madaxe_again 6y ago
Based on the parties involved here, it’ll be used to control the outcome of elections to ensure the Tories keep in power forever. The guy running it, Mosley, is the grandson of Oswald Mosley - founder and leader of the British Union of Fascists - “Hooray for the blackshirts” and all that. He’s a “Tory activist”, which basically means he would like to see a fascist white ethnostate. I’m not exaggerating. This is who the Tories have become - the party of brexit, of isolationism, of eugenics, of corrupt in-dealing, arbitrary justice, and “hostile environments”. Literally every name in there is someone associated with the far right. There’s also prior form to this end - see the as yet unresolved and probably never to be resolved hoo-hah over Cambridge analytica. This smells like Cummings and his gang.
- Angostura 6y ago
  > I’m not exaggerating He said, exaggerating.
  - madaxe_again 6y ago
    No. I went to school with plenty of the clade now in power - one is a cabinet minister, another just an MP, others are Tory activists or were Tory MPs until the last election. The cabinet minister was the most profoundly racist and bigoted person in my year. I won’t repeat the kind of slurs he routinely came out with here, but I will say that he was kicked out of history, repeatedly, for saying “they got what they deserved”, when discussing the holocaust. The MP was suspended for a term for sexual assault. Yes, that’s anecdotal, but it speaks of the character of the type of person attracted to their ideology. In more concrete terms, if you look at what is being said, privately and publicly, what is becoming policy, which dead cats are being thrown at the press, it is extremely worrying.
    - Angostura 6y ago
      Feel free to name names
      - madaxe_again 6y ago
        I like breathing, so no. My godfather spoke out against them a few years ago when told to preside over a secret court. They destroyed him through the press. Cameron went on national TV to condemn him for being a paedophile apologist, when he’s absolutely no such thing, and the court transcripts from the supposed incident clearly show that the remarks ascribed to him were actually made by a police constable. His wife committed suicide in the aftermath, and his children fled the country as they were being threatened by the public and hounded by the gutter press. He is a shadow of the man he was. So no. I won’t name names.
        throwaway_pdp09 6y ago
        I can't find any relevant comment by cameron accusing/condemning anyone for being a 'paedophile apologist'. Or anyone being a godfather so accused. It's difficult to evaluate such accusations without more info, but it's equally important to know this stuff if what you say is accurate. These are very serious claims indeed.
        deleted 6y ago
        [deleted]
        jacobush 6y ago
        That incident, putting aside for a second whether it was right or wrong to so publicly and forcefully condemn him - there certainly would not have made much difference if Cameron would have mentioned it or not. The prosecutors wording and presentation was ill-advised and he would have get gotten a lot of flak regardless.
- jjgreen 6y ago
  "Hurrah for the Blackshirts" was actually a piece in the Daily Mail https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Rothermere_-_Hurrah_for_the_Blackshirts.jpg https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Rothermere_-_Hurrah_...
  - madaxe_again 6y ago
    Yes, writing about Oswald Mosley and his Blackshirts.
- chimprich 6y ago
  I'm a lefty so perfectly open to believe bad things about the Tories, but this criticism is ridiculous. > The guy running it, Mosley, is the grandson of Oswald Mosley Sharing about a quarter of your genes with a leading fascist from two generations previously in a very different social and cultural time doesn't mean you're a fascist yourself. To say that who your grandfather was defines your views is a kind of genetic fascism itself. A quick look at his Twitter feed shows retweets of Guardian articles and Labour MPs' posts. Hardly definitive, but he doesn't look like an extremist. > He’s a “Tory activist”, which basically means he would like to see a fascist white ethnostate. I'm sure there are a great many Tory activists with unpleasant views, but this doesn't follow at all.
- RobertKerans 6y ago
  "far right" and "literally" breaking free of the constrictive confines of dictionary definition in some style there
harryf 6y ago
There's been rumours of the NHS being privatised and that the UK adopts a more US based healthcare model - https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/dec/11/nhs-us-health-care-trade-deal-uk-election https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/dec/11/nhs-us... Having access to NHS data could potentially help you do things like; - build lists of potential customers to target with insurance - combined with their medical histories you can assess who the profitable customers might be - that you could sell nicely to insurance companies - identify how drugs and treatments are being priced and used - useful market data if you want to launch drugs on the UK market that might be competing - identify which parts of the NHS are valuable / profitable as part of selective privatisation - what's worth buying in other words. Leave the unprofitable parts un-privatised... I'm sure there's plenty of money to be made selling that kind of data.
- cturner 6y ago
  There's been rumours The notion that anyone is steering the UK towards the quirky US model is simple fear-mongering. Even the partisan article you cite only talks about privatisation of elements of the NHS. A mixed public/private health care model can be effective policy. The Australian system serves as an example of this. The NHS is an inefficient mess, despite the efforts of so many of its staff. It is reasonable that we should be able to debate policy models. The tone of the Guardian article does not assist reasonable debate.
  - DanBC 6y ago
    We already have a mixed private / public model. Billions of the NHS budget is spent on NHS patients in private providers. > The NHS is an inefficient mess Mostly caused by the incoherent Lansley reforms and years of austerity from Hunt.
- stefantalpalaru 6y ago
  > There's been rumours of the NHS being privatised https://www.nhsforsale.info/overview/what-nhs-care-has-been-outsourced/ https://www.nhsforsale.info/overview/what-nhs-care-has-been-...

grey-area 6y ago

Sell the data to spy agencies?

madaxe_again 6y ago

Based on the parties involved here, it’ll be used to control the outcome of elections to ensure the Tories keep in power forever. The guy running it, Mosley, is the grandson of Oswald Mosley - founder and leader of the British Union of Fascists - “Hooray for the blackshirts” and all that. He’s a “Tory activist”, which basically means he would like to see a fascist white ethnostate. I’m not exaggerating. This is who the Tories have become - the party of brexit, of isolationism, of eugenics, of corrupt in-dealing, arbitrary justice, and “hostile environments”. Literally every name in there is someone associated with the far right. There’s also prior form to this end - see the as yet unresolved and probably never to be resolved hoo-hah over Cambridge analytica. This smells like Cummings and his gang.

Angostura 6y ago
> I’m not exaggerating He said, exaggerating.
- madaxe_again 6y ago
  No. I went to school with plenty of the clade now in power - one is a cabinet minister, another just an MP, others are Tory activists or were Tory MPs until the last election. The cabinet minister was the most profoundly racist and bigoted person in my year. I won’t repeat the kind of slurs he routinely came out with here, but I will say that he was kicked out of history, repeatedly, for saying “they got what they deserved”, when discussing the holocaust. The MP was suspended for a term for sexual assault. Yes, that’s anecdotal, but it speaks of the character of the type of person attracted to their ideology. In more concrete terms, if you look at what is being said, privately and publicly, what is becoming policy, which dead cats are being thrown at the press, it is extremely worrying.
  - Angostura 6y ago
    Feel free to name names
    - madaxe_again 6y ago
      I like breathing, so no. My godfather spoke out against them a few years ago when told to preside over a secret court. They destroyed him through the press. Cameron went on national TV to condemn him for being a paedophile apologist, when he’s absolutely no such thing, and the court transcripts from the supposed incident clearly show that the remarks ascribed to him were actually made by a police constable. His wife committed suicide in the aftermath, and his children fled the country as they were being threatened by the public and hounded by the gutter press. He is a shadow of the man he was. So no. I won’t name names.
      - throwaway_pdp09 6y ago
        I can't find any relevant comment by cameron accusing/condemning anyone for being a 'paedophile apologist'. Or anyone being a godfather so accused. It's difficult to evaluate such accusations without more info, but it's equally important to know this stuff if what you say is accurate. These are very serious claims indeed.
        deleted 6y ago
        [deleted]
      - jacobush 6y ago
        That incident, putting aside for a second whether it was right or wrong to so publicly and forcefully condemn him - there certainly would not have made much difference if Cameron would have mentioned it or not. The prosecutors wording and presentation was ill-advised and he would have get gotten a lot of flak regardless.
jjgreen 6y ago
"Hurrah for the Blackshirts" was actually a piece in the Daily Mail https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Rothermere_-_Hurrah_for_the_Blackshirts.jpg https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Rothermere_-_Hurrah_...
- madaxe_again 6y ago
  Yes, writing about Oswald Mosley and his Blackshirts.
chimprich 6y ago
I'm a lefty so perfectly open to believe bad things about the Tories, but this criticism is ridiculous. > The guy running it, Mosley, is the grandson of Oswald Mosley Sharing about a quarter of your genes with a leading fascist from two generations previously in a very different social and cultural time doesn't mean you're a fascist yourself. To say that who your grandfather was defines your views is a kind of genetic fascism itself. A quick look at his Twitter feed shows retweets of Guardian articles and Labour MPs' posts. Hardly definitive, but he doesn't look like an extremist. > He’s a “Tory activist”, which basically means he would like to see a fascist white ethnostate. I'm sure there are a great many Tory activists with unpleasant views, but this doesn't follow at all.
RobertKerans 6y ago
"far right" and "literally" breaking free of the constrictive confines of dictionary definition in some style there

harryf 6y ago

There's been rumours of the NHS being privatised and that the UK adopts a more US based healthcare model - https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/dec/11/nhs-us-health-care-trade-deal-uk-election https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/dec/11/nhs-us... Having access to NHS data could potentially help you do things like; - build lists of potential customers to target with insurance - combined with their medical histories you can assess who the profitable customers might be - that you could sell nicely to insurance companies - identify how drugs and treatments are being priced and used - useful market data if you want to launch drugs on the UK market that might be competing - identify which parts of the NHS are valuable / profitable as part of selective privatisation - what's worth buying in other words. Leave the unprofitable parts un-privatised... I'm sure there's plenty of money to be made selling that kind of data.

cturner 6y ago
There's been rumours The notion that anyone is steering the UK towards the quirky US model is simple fear-mongering. Even the partisan article you cite only talks about privatisation of elements of the NHS. A mixed public/private health care model can be effective policy. The Australian system serves as an example of this. The NHS is an inefficient mess, despite the efforts of so many of its staff. It is reasonable that we should be able to debate policy models. The tone of the Guardian article does not assist reasonable debate.
- DanBC 6y ago
  We already have a mixed private / public model. Billions of the NHS budget is spent on NHS patients in private providers. > The NHS is an inefficient mess Mostly caused by the incoherent Lansley reforms and years of austerity from Hunt.
stefantalpalaru 6y ago
> There's been rumours of the NHS being privatised https://www.nhsforsale.info/overview/what-nhs-care-has-been-outsourced/ https://www.nhsforsale.info/overview/what-nhs-care-has-been-...