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Europe had many more dialects and languages than now... Some of extinction stories are genocidal as well. We have to assume a lot about what happened as Rome co

by netcan 6y ago

Europe had many more dialects and languages than now... Some of extinction stories are genocidal as well. We have to assume a lot about what happened as Rome colonised southern europe, for example, but much of it probably rhymes what happened in the americas.

throwlaplace 6y ago
this is like people comparing the indigenous african slave trade to the triangle trade - completely facile. >Rome colonised southern europe colonization in the ancient world wasn't rapacious like it was in the new world. conquered peoples maintained much of their way of life and simply became vassal. in the roman case (towards the end) they even got roman citizenship. Edit:I finally figured out hn downvotes - paper over a genocide nbd - use the word facile downvotes
- Spooky23 6y ago
  Tell that to the Gauls!
  - throwlaplace 6y ago
    >In the five centuries between Caesar's conquest and the collapse of the Western Roman Empire, the Gaulish language and cultural identity underwent a syncretism with the Roman culture of the new governing class, and evolved into a hybrid Gallo-Roman culture that eventually permeated all levels of society https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Gaul https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Gaul Can you point to symbiosis with native American culture that resembles that to any extent today in the US? All we have are racist football team mascots
    - mikepurvis 6y ago
      I think the parent may be making a joke about the village from Asterix: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asterix#Description https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asterix#Description
- mikepurvis 6y ago
  The people being conquered in Europe were also a lot less vulnerable in several key ways— my understanding is that they were largely overwhelmed by superior military tactics and infrastructure (roads and so on), but once conquered they were at a similar level in overall technology and well positioned to participate in the larger Roman economy. North American native peoples faced new infectious diseases that they weren't at all prepared for, a huge technological disparity (guns), and a lot of predatory economics (trading away valuable furs for beads and trinkets).
dntbnmpls 6y ago
> Europe had many more dialects and languages than now... Yes I know. The difference is that with the natives, the language disappeared because the people got exterminated rather than through forced standardization/adoption of national languages.
chewz 6y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yotvingia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yotvingia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Prussian_language https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Prussian_language https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sudovian_language https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sudovian_language https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vends https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vends https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wends https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wends https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorbs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorbs

by netcan 6y ago

throwlaplace 6y ago

this is like people comparing the indigenous african slave trade to the triangle trade - completely facile. >Rome colonised southern europe colonization in the ancient world wasn't rapacious like it was in the new world. conquered peoples maintained much of their way of life and simply became vassal. in the roman case (towards the end) they even got roman citizenship. Edit:I finally figured out hn downvotes - paper over a genocide nbd - use the word facile downvotes

Spooky23 6y ago
Tell that to the Gauls!
- throwlaplace 6y ago
  >In the five centuries between Caesar's conquest and the collapse of the Western Roman Empire, the Gaulish language and cultural identity underwent a syncretism with the Roman culture of the new governing class, and evolved into a hybrid Gallo-Roman culture that eventually permeated all levels of society https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Gaul https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Gaul Can you point to symbiosis with native American culture that resembles that to any extent today in the US? All we have are racist football team mascots
  - mikepurvis 6y ago
    I think the parent may be making a joke about the village from Asterix: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asterix#Description https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asterix#Description
mikepurvis 6y ago
The people being conquered in Europe were also a lot less vulnerable in several key ways— my understanding is that they were largely overwhelmed by superior military tactics and infrastructure (roads and so on), but once conquered they were at a similar level in overall technology and well positioned to participate in the larger Roman economy. North American native peoples faced new infectious diseases that they weren't at all prepared for, a huge technological disparity (guns), and a lot of predatory economics (trading away valuable furs for beads and trinkets).

dntbnmpls 6y ago

> Europe had many more dialects and languages than now... Yes I know. The difference is that with the natives, the language disappeared because the people got exterminated rather than through forced standardization/adoption of national languages.

chewz 6y ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yotvingia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yotvingia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Prussian_language https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Prussian_language https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sudovian_language https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sudovian_language https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vends https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vends https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wends https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wends https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorbs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorbs