3 ms·

Interesting that being an ex-smoker increases the risk, but being a current smoker decreases it. Seems like there is some short term benefit to smoking that out

by 0-_-0 6y ago

Interesting that being an ex-smoker increases the risk, but being a current smoker decreases it. Seems like there is some short term benefit to smoking that outweighs its long term negative health effects.

supernova87a 6y ago
Maybe people who are ex-smokers have had serious lung issues, quit smoking, and are more susceptible. While people smoking have not yet progressed to that stage.
StringyBob 6y ago
Maybe being forced to go outside in the sunshine for a cigarette break!
Nextgrid 6y ago
Could it be a measurement error or that smokers who would’ve died because of covid already did die of something else or get a different condition before, essentially making it survivor bias?
- 0-_-0 6y ago
  The survivor bias argument doesn't work for the other health problems listed so I don't think it would work for smoking
goblin89 6y ago
As someone who relatively freshly started smoking 1.5 years ago, I find it insidious. After stopping for a day or two, I actually feel better as tension goes away and I sleep a lot. Shortly, however, I start randomly getting sneezes, runny nose, and slight ill-like feeling in my head. Part of what makes me start again is the desire to avoid spooking others with those flu-like symptoms in the middle of an epidemic, since I live in a densely populated area. I don’t have a clear idea of what mechanism is at work here, my hypothesis is that the withdrawal somehow suppresses my immune system. Unfortunately, as far as I can tell, nicotine patches aren’t as good (or useful at all) at reducing the respiratory symptoms in short term. I suppose it’s not purely nicotine withdrawal that’s causing this.
- robinhouston 6y ago
  This is a real effect. Smoking paralyses the cilia; about 4–6 days after cessation, the cilia become active again and start to bring up mucus from the lungs. The good news is that these symptoms are temporary. Public health communications on the benefits of cessation don’t usually mention this. I wonder if that’s a mistake. I would have thought it puts a lot of people off quitting, and maybe if they knew what was happening it would be easier to deal with.
  - goblin89 6y ago
    This is definitely useful to know. I reckon some smokers suffering from this upon withdrawal would suspect immunosuppression, and choose to continue. When I have a week or so apart from the crowds, I’ll see how long it takes to push through those symptoms. (I thought if withdrawal causes immune system suppression, this effect could explain the apparent COVID statistic correlation mentioned by 0-_-0 in parent comment, but from your information it’s unlikely to.)
    - robinhouston 6y ago
      I think the leading hypothesis is that nicotine may have a protective effect against COVID-19, which is strong enough to more than counteract the negative influence of the lung damage caused by smoking. (This would explain why former smokers are worse off, since they have residual lung damage but no protective nicotine.) Of course this is all quite hypothetical, and may turn out to be wrong, but I gather it’s biochemically plausible. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7192087/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7192087/
_0ffh 6y ago
Take it with a shovel of salt, but I've read the following speculative claim: Nicotine docks to a kind of receptor that is also used by COVID-19, thereby denying opportunity to the Virus. But at the same time, habitual smokers tend to develop a higher density of these receptors. That would make smokers less susceptible while they can smoke regularly, but more susceptible upon smoking cessation.

by 0-_-0 6y ago

supernova87a 6y ago

Maybe people who are ex-smokers have had serious lung issues, quit smoking, and are more susceptible. While people smoking have not yet progressed to that stage.

StringyBob 6y ago

Maybe being forced to go outside in the sunshine for a cigarette break!

Nextgrid 6y ago

Could it be a measurement error or that smokers who would’ve died because of covid already did die of something else or get a different condition before, essentially making it survivor bias?

0-_-0 6y ago
The survivor bias argument doesn't work for the other health problems listed so I don't think it would work for smoking

goblin89 6y ago

As someone who relatively freshly started smoking 1.5 years ago, I find it insidious. After stopping for a day or two, I actually feel better as tension goes away and I sleep a lot. Shortly, however, I start randomly getting sneezes, runny nose, and slight ill-like feeling in my head. Part of what makes me start again is the desire to avoid spooking others with those flu-like symptoms in the middle of an epidemic, since I live in a densely populated area. I don’t have a clear idea of what mechanism is at work here, my hypothesis is that the withdrawal somehow suppresses my immune system. Unfortunately, as far as I can tell, nicotine patches aren’t as good (or useful at all) at reducing the respiratory symptoms in short term. I suppose it’s not purely nicotine withdrawal that’s causing this.

robinhouston 6y ago
This is a real effect. Smoking paralyses the cilia; about 4–6 days after cessation, the cilia become active again and start to bring up mucus from the lungs. The good news is that these symptoms are temporary. Public health communications on the benefits of cessation don’t usually mention this. I wonder if that’s a mistake. I would have thought it puts a lot of people off quitting, and maybe if they knew what was happening it would be easier to deal with.
- goblin89 6y ago
  This is definitely useful to know. I reckon some smokers suffering from this upon withdrawal would suspect immunosuppression, and choose to continue. When I have a week or so apart from the crowds, I’ll see how long it takes to push through those symptoms. (I thought if withdrawal causes immune system suppression, this effect could explain the apparent COVID statistic correlation mentioned by 0-_-0 in parent comment, but from your information it’s unlikely to.)
  - robinhouston 6y ago
    I think the leading hypothesis is that nicotine may have a protective effect against COVID-19, which is strong enough to more than counteract the negative influence of the lung damage caused by smoking. (This would explain why former smokers are worse off, since they have residual lung damage but no protective nicotine.) Of course this is all quite hypothetical, and may turn out to be wrong, but I gather it’s biochemically plausible. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7192087/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7192087/

_0ffh 6y ago

Take it with a shovel of salt, but I've read the following speculative claim: Nicotine docks to a kind of receptor that is also used by COVID-19, thereby denying opportunity to the Virus. But at the same time, habitual smokers tend to develop a higher density of these receptors. That would make smokers less susceptible while they can smoke regularly, but more susceptible upon smoking cessation.