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Yeah, unfortunately point #3 makes people think they shouldn't wear masks. I was joking to a friend that the correct "American" response to COVID-19 is legal l

by cozzyd 6y ago

Yeah, unfortunately point #3 makes people think they shouldn't wear masks. I was joking to a friend that the correct "American" response to COVID-19 is legal liability for getting others sick, but alas, that requires effective contact tracing.

kenhwang 6y ago
Even more American would be to fine/arrest people caught without a mask.
- justforyou 6y ago
  Even more American would be to fine/arrest poor people caught without a mask. FTFY.
- magicsmoke 6y ago
  That's the East Asian response. A law like that would probably get dragged through the courts in America with the rest of the media circus before being struck down as government overreach. As the original poster said, legal liability between private individuals with lots of court fees is very American.
  - kenhwang 6y ago
    Definitely see it being dragged through the courts. But it'd be the most tolerable enforcement mechanism to the wealthy elite who wouldn't mind just eating a fine. The East Asian solution takes it one step further with mass surveillance.
  - maxerickson 6y ago
    There's lots of news about people getting manhandled by police because they don't have a mask on. Of course, in wealthier areas, there are stories about the police handing out masks to people that aren't wearing them. So I think we are handling it in a very US way.
- vinay427 6y ago
  I don't think this works from a European perspective, at least based on the country I live in where the opposite seems more true. I guess it might make sense compared to some east Asian countries as another commenter noted.
hckr_news 6y ago
Oh dear I might be starting to see symptoms of this thing after a neighbor coughed in my space the other day (unsure if they had it). Now I’m wondering if that’s enough to sue them for endangering me and potentially make me miss work time..
- xenonite 6y ago
  Hope you will be alright. Sadly, you wouldn't be the first to be assaulted with SARS-CoV2 at work. See for example the tragic story of a train ticket worker who died two weeks after being spat at in London Victoria station. https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-52616071 https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-52616071
- whylie 6y ago
  Sounds a little pre-meditated, if you're that worried why don't you go get tested :) Also I think you would be hard pressed to isolate where your infection originated if you were positive - so you might not have the best luck with suing your co-worker. Also that just sounds a little nuts.
abootstrapper 6y ago
I think we should have a national standard "Covid Danger Rating System," like the Fire Danger Rating system. Track it like the weather. Have the local weather man discuss that regions current Covid Risk rating and what it means. Do it every time the weather is broadcast. Add to that, let's make being caught spreading Covid by not following the current ratings recommendation a punishable offense. That way it's not illegal to not wear a mask, or not social distance, but if we're at Covid-Risk 5, and an outbreak is traced back to your negligence, you'd be fined, jailed, something. Same way you'd be punished for being caught starting a wild fire with a campfire during burn ban. We wouldn't even need perfect contact tracing for this to work. The majority of people will follow the recommendation for social good, and others will for the threat of possible punishment. It's not perfect but a unified plan that everyone understands, plus some teeth for enforcing it would go a long way.
- ahdeanz 6y ago
  This is a good way to get people to hide their infections and make stopping spread harder.
  - abootstrapper 6y ago
    How so? There’d be no penalty for spreading covid. The penalty would come if you spread it by willfully ignoring the current guidelines.
    - cozzyd 6y ago
      Those who don't follow guidelines are also likely to not want to get in trouble. I think the same problem happens with forest fires...
kube-system 6y ago
And #2 would be cited as a reason to open everything back up immediately.
- throw_away 6y ago
  Or is it friends and family like how 70% of auto crashes happen within 10 miles of home simply because that's where you drive most often?
  - cozzyd 6y ago
    I think this might be correct, especially during a lockdown, those are the people most people see.
    - user_50123890 6y ago
      Whether you get infected or not is a game of chance. There are a lot of factors affecting the probability: * Being indoors during contact (increases) * Duration of contact (every minute increases) * Physical distance between contacts (every meter decreases) * Amount of contacts (every person increases) * Wearing masks (decreases) * Washing hands (decreases) * Coughing, speaking, singing during contacts (increases) Meeting people close to you ticks basically every probability-increasing checkbox in the list.
      - Fjolsvith 6y ago
        Don't forget presence of pre-existant antibodies in the person. (decreases)

by cozzyd 6y ago

kenhwang 6y ago

Even more American would be to fine/arrest people caught without a mask.

justforyou 6y ago
Even more American would be to fine/arrest poor people caught without a mask. FTFY.
magicsmoke 6y ago
That's the East Asian response. A law like that would probably get dragged through the courts in America with the rest of the media circus before being struck down as government overreach. As the original poster said, legal liability between private individuals with lots of court fees is very American.
- kenhwang 6y ago
  Definitely see it being dragged through the courts. But it'd be the most tolerable enforcement mechanism to the wealthy elite who wouldn't mind just eating a fine. The East Asian solution takes it one step further with mass surveillance.
- maxerickson 6y ago
  There's lots of news about people getting manhandled by police because they don't have a mask on. Of course, in wealthier areas, there are stories about the police handing out masks to people that aren't wearing them. So I think we are handling it in a very US way.
vinay427 6y ago
I don't think this works from a European perspective, at least based on the country I live in where the opposite seems more true. I guess it might make sense compared to some east Asian countries as another commenter noted.

hckr_news 6y ago

Oh dear I might be starting to see symptoms of this thing after a neighbor coughed in my space the other day (unsure if they had it). Now I’m wondering if that’s enough to sue them for endangering me and potentially make me miss work time..

xenonite 6y ago
Hope you will be alright. Sadly, you wouldn't be the first to be assaulted with SARS-CoV2 at work. See for example the tragic story of a train ticket worker who died two weeks after being spat at in London Victoria station. https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-52616071 https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-52616071
whylie 6y ago
Sounds a little pre-meditated, if you're that worried why don't you go get tested :) Also I think you would be hard pressed to isolate where your infection originated if you were positive - so you might not have the best luck with suing your co-worker. Also that just sounds a little nuts.

abootstrapper 6y ago

I think we should have a national standard "Covid Danger Rating System," like the Fire Danger Rating system. Track it like the weather. Have the local weather man discuss that regions current Covid Risk rating and what it means. Do it every time the weather is broadcast. Add to that, let's make being caught spreading Covid by not following the current ratings recommendation a punishable offense. That way it's not illegal to not wear a mask, or not social distance, but if we're at Covid-Risk 5, and an outbreak is traced back to your negligence, you'd be fined, jailed, something. Same way you'd be punished for being caught starting a wild fire with a campfire during burn ban. We wouldn't even need perfect contact tracing for this to work. The majority of people will follow the recommendation for social good, and others will for the threat of possible punishment. It's not perfect but a unified plan that everyone understands, plus some teeth for enforcing it would go a long way.

ahdeanz 6y ago
This is a good way to get people to hide their infections and make stopping spread harder.
- abootstrapper 6y ago
  How so? There’d be no penalty for spreading covid. The penalty would come if you spread it by willfully ignoring the current guidelines.
  - cozzyd 6y ago
    Those who don't follow guidelines are also likely to not want to get in trouble. I think the same problem happens with forest fires...

kube-system 6y ago

And #2 would be cited as a reason to open everything back up immediately.

throw_away 6y ago
Or is it friends and family like how 70% of auto crashes happen within 10 miles of home simply because that's where you drive most often?
- cozzyd 6y ago
  I think this might be correct, especially during a lockdown, those are the people most people see.
  - user_50123890 6y ago
    Whether you get infected or not is a game of chance. There are a lot of factors affecting the probability: * Being indoors during contact (increases) * Duration of contact (every minute increases) * Physical distance between contacts (every meter decreases) * Amount of contacts (every person increases) * Wearing masks (decreases) * Washing hands (decreases) * Coughing, speaking, singing during contacts (increases) Meeting people close to you ticks basically every probability-increasing checkbox in the list.
    - Fjolsvith 6y ago
      Don't forget presence of pre-existant antibodies in the person. (decreases)