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> when you order delivery from one of the large delivery partners like GrubHub or DoorDash - not only do you pay a delivery fee, service fee, and a generous tip

> when you order delivery from one of the large delivery partners like GrubHub or DoorDash - not only do you pay a delivery fee, service fee, and a generous tip to the driver. But we restaurant owners also pay...these fees can range from 15% to 35% of your entire order. If these fees are too high, then why accept orders from these providers? If you don't get enough orders otherwise, then these services are providing value. If you do, then simply refuse to discount for these providers and handle the orders yourself. This post, and others like it, seem like they're asking consumers to avoid these services, but it seems like it would be much easier for restaraunts to refuse to participate.

m-ee 6y ago
These services will go out of their way to place orders against the restaurants will if they choose not to accept them. Even going as far as having employees call in phone orders while posing as regular customers.
- forgotmylogin2 6y ago
  So what? Then the restaurant doesn't have to pay a fee. If the problem is that the delivery services are charging high fees to restaurants, then terminating the relationship with the delivery service solves that problem. If the delivery service wants to make orders like a normal customer without any discounts, that's good for the restaurants.
  - m-ee 6y ago
    Restaurants don't always have the capacity to make delivery orders and may not want to deal with the logistics of impatient drivers coming in and demanding their food in the middle of a dinner rush. In some cases they've set up fake websites and taken orders for restaurants that don't even offer takeout. Whatever their reasons for not wanting the business the OP's point was 'they can always opt out' which just isn't true.
  - ryanwaggoner 6y ago
    No, because by doing so, the delivery services are effectively injecting themselves into the middle of the relationship between the customer and the restaurant. Over time, most customers will launch the app when they're hungry in general or for a type of food, and if they don't see a specific restaurant there anymore but they do see competitors that have decent ratings, they'll just order from them.
    - forgotmylogin2 6y ago
      That's a lot of businesses. The local liquor store "injects themselves" between you and Budweiser when they sell you beer. It's not inherently evil or unethical to act as a middleman, especially when you provide additional value that the original business does not.
      - battery_cowboy 6y ago
        Yes, the unethical part is stealing the Google search results, taking the tips from the drivers instead of distributing them, etc. All the stuff you heard about over the past years. If they had an ethical business, we wouldn't be reading this article.
        MVorlm 6y ago
        There's no "stealing" or theft here. Based on this article, and the comments on this thread, advertising is part of the package/contract. Restaurants can simply not partner with these services.
        battery_cowboy 6y ago
        The restaurant owners aren't knowledgeable enough in this area to understand the harm from the contracts, they're not dumb, but they don't realize the power they give to the company. That's an unethical practice, to take advantage of someone like that.
- codazoda 6y ago
  That's probably fine; the restaurant wouldn't be giving a discount in that case.
- paxys 6y ago
  Which is...fine? From the restaurant's perspective it's just another order. They are paying nothing extra to Doordash.
macintux 6y ago
Right now these owners are presumably trying to hang on for dear life. I’d be afraid to stop using a popular delivery service.
- adharmad 6y ago
  Right now is a truly bad time for anything drastic that will affect your reveune stream. But what about pre-covid times?
donmcronald 6y ago
It's a critical mass service. Once they own enough of your (target) customers' eyeballs, you can't ignore them. It's pretty simple: 1. Buy ads aka eyeballs aka popularity. 2. Subsidize early adopters via advertising to help them outperform competitors. 3. Gain critical mass. 4. Charge businesses to advertise on your platform. Make sure you pass along the costs for step 1. You could do the same thing right now with a lot of industries as long as you have some type of carrot to dangle in front of the early adopters. Imagine building a landscaping website / app where the extra value is that people who are having a hectic day can click a button and have someone show up and cut their grass. As long as you advertise enough early adopters would see a bunch of extra business, especially if they can pick and choose jobs to saturate their schedule. Word would get around and every landscaping business in the city would want to get in on it, but not many of them would consider what's going to happen once you've monopolized the supply of customers. Spoiler alert! It's the same thing that happens in this article. You start charging businesses to advertise on your platform because you control their customer supply.

m-ee 6y ago

These services will go out of their way to place orders against the restaurants will if they choose not to accept them. Even going as far as having employees call in phone orders while posing as regular customers.

forgotmylogin2 6y ago
So what? Then the restaurant doesn't have to pay a fee. If the problem is that the delivery services are charging high fees to restaurants, then terminating the relationship with the delivery service solves that problem. If the delivery service wants to make orders like a normal customer without any discounts, that's good for the restaurants.
- m-ee 6y ago
  Restaurants don't always have the capacity to make delivery orders and may not want to deal with the logistics of impatient drivers coming in and demanding their food in the middle of a dinner rush. In some cases they've set up fake websites and taken orders for restaurants that don't even offer takeout. Whatever their reasons for not wanting the business the OP's point was 'they can always opt out' which just isn't true.
- ryanwaggoner 6y ago
  No, because by doing so, the delivery services are effectively injecting themselves into the middle of the relationship between the customer and the restaurant. Over time, most customers will launch the app when they're hungry in general or for a type of food, and if they don't see a specific restaurant there anymore but they do see competitors that have decent ratings, they'll just order from them.
  - forgotmylogin2 6y ago
    That's a lot of businesses. The local liquor store "injects themselves" between you and Budweiser when they sell you beer. It's not inherently evil or unethical to act as a middleman, especially when you provide additional value that the original business does not.
    - battery_cowboy 6y ago
      Yes, the unethical part is stealing the Google search results, taking the tips from the drivers instead of distributing them, etc. All the stuff you heard about over the past years. If they had an ethical business, we wouldn't be reading this article.
      - MVorlm 6y ago
        There's no "stealing" or theft here. Based on this article, and the comments on this thread, advertising is part of the package/contract. Restaurants can simply not partner with these services.
        battery_cowboy 6y ago
        The restaurant owners aren't knowledgeable enough in this area to understand the harm from the contracts, they're not dumb, but they don't realize the power they give to the company. That's an unethical practice, to take advantage of someone like that.
codazoda 6y ago
That's probably fine; the restaurant wouldn't be giving a discount in that case.
paxys 6y ago
Which is...fine? From the restaurant's perspective it's just another order. They are paying nothing extra to Doordash.

macintux 6y ago

Right now these owners are presumably trying to hang on for dear life. I’d be afraid to stop using a popular delivery service.

adharmad 6y ago
Right now is a truly bad time for anything drastic that will affect your reveune stream. But what about pre-covid times?

donmcronald 6y ago

It's a critical mass service. Once they own enough of your (target) customers' eyeballs, you can't ignore them. It's pretty simple: 1. Buy ads aka eyeballs aka popularity. 2. Subsidize early adopters via advertising to help them outperform competitors. 3. Gain critical mass. 4. Charge businesses to advertise on your platform. Make sure you pass along the costs for step 1. You could do the same thing right now with a lot of industries as long as you have some type of carrot to dangle in front of the early adopters. Imagine building a landscaping website / app where the extra value is that people who are having a hectic day can click a button and have someone show up and cut their grass. As long as you advertise enough early adopters would see a bunch of extra business, especially if they can pick and choose jobs to saturate their schedule. Word would get around and every landscaping business in the city would want to get in on it, but not many of them would consider what's going to happen once you've monopolized the supply of customers. Spoiler alert! It's the same thing that happens in this article. You start charging businesses to advertise on your platform because you control their customer supply.