3 ms·

This is not true at all. You know people in other western countries are actually significantly more free than in the USA right? New Zealand is widely regarded

This is not true at all. You know people in other western countries are actually significantly more free than in the USA right? New Zealand is widely regarded as the most free country, and they also don’t have coronavirus.

dgzl 6y ago
I'd like some source material on your claim about freedoms, and New Zealand is a tiny island, very easy to control.
- craigsmansion 6y ago
  > I'd like some source material on your claim about freedoms Let's start at the bottom then: >> The other countries you speak about have already lost their rights, or never had them to begin with. >and New Zealand is a tiny island, very easy to control What you're saying here is basically: "even if you back it up with source material, I'm going to claim the US is more diverse/different so it doesn't really apply." In other words, it's US exceptionalism both ways around, that is, circular reasoning. Why should anyone bother to try and have a good faith argument here?
  - aplummer 6y ago
    > In other words, it's US exceptionalism both ways around, that is, circular reasoning. Why should anyone bother to try and have a good faith argument here? I've assumed good intent with my reply and included size examples of Australia and Canada referring to my linked paper, so I suppose we will find out.
- aplummer 6y ago
  Here is a well thought out analysis of different attributes tha constitute "free-ness" that breaks down many kind of freedom[1]. Obviously Americans get full marks for "freedom of movement and assembly" but there are other types of freedom. The USA doesn't even break the top 10. If your interest is genuine I recommend further research starting with "why does the USA have the highest incarceration rate in the world", "prison industrial complex", "victims / incarceration by race" (given freedom in the USA is unevenly distributed). I'm not saying the USA isn't generally a free place (it obviously is and has many good parts), but comparatively it's not the most free. Also to reply directly to your point about size, Australia and Canada are both higher in the paper I provided, which are (equal sized / slightly smaller) but more sparse, so I don't think size is the issue. [1] https://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/human-freedom-index-files/cato-human-freedom-index-update-3.pdf https://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/human-freedom-inde...

dgzl 6y ago

I'd like some source material on your claim about freedoms, and New Zealand is a tiny island, very easy to control.

craigsmansion 6y ago
> I'd like some source material on your claim about freedoms Let's start at the bottom then: >> The other countries you speak about have already lost their rights, or never had them to begin with. >and New Zealand is a tiny island, very easy to control What you're saying here is basically: "even if you back it up with source material, I'm going to claim the US is more diverse/different so it doesn't really apply." In other words, it's US exceptionalism both ways around, that is, circular reasoning. Why should anyone bother to try and have a good faith argument here?
- aplummer 6y ago
  > In other words, it's US exceptionalism both ways around, that is, circular reasoning. Why should anyone bother to try and have a good faith argument here? I've assumed good intent with my reply and included size examples of Australia and Canada referring to my linked paper, so I suppose we will find out.
aplummer 6y ago
Here is a well thought out analysis of different attributes tha constitute "free-ness" that breaks down many kind of freedom[1]. Obviously Americans get full marks for "freedom of movement and assembly" but there are other types of freedom. The USA doesn't even break the top 10. If your interest is genuine I recommend further research starting with "why does the USA have the highest incarceration rate in the world", "prison industrial complex", "victims / incarceration by race" (given freedom in the USA is unevenly distributed). I'm not saying the USA isn't generally a free place (it obviously is and has many good parts), but comparatively it's not the most free. Also to reply directly to your point about size, Australia and Canada are both higher in the paper I provided, which are (equal sized / slightly smaller) but more sparse, so I don't think size is the issue. [1] https://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/human-freedom-index-files/cato-human-freedom-index-update-3.pdf https://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/human-freedom-inde...