5 ms·

What do you mean "required"? Like, they wouldn't accept a clean, non-scanned copy? That's absurd.

baicunko 6y ago
I usually sign documents on my iPad but in this case they told me the signature had to be from a pen. COVID and everything means I don't have a printer nor a scanner at home so I developed this to "scan my iPad signed documents" worked like a charm!
- pmiller2 6y ago
  As a technological toy, I think this sort of thing is cool. In fact, you can do it in LaTeX pretty easily: https://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/94523/simulate-a-scanned-paper https://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/94523/simulate-a-sca... It's interesting that the problem they had was with the signature. You can very easily make a handwritten signature on an iPad. I don't see how there's any practical way to tell the difference between a high-quality, handwritten signature done on an iPad with either a finger or an Apple Pencil and a scanned signature done with a pen. Are you sure that's not just some excuse they gave you?
  - miles 6y ago
    > you can do it in LaTeX pretty easily: https://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/94523/simulate-a-scanned-paper https://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/94523/simulate-a-sca... Ironically, despite being hosted on tex.stackexchange.com, all of the answers use ImageMagick, Photoshop, or Windows 10/Adobe Acrobat.
    - _emacsomancer_ 6y ago
      Interestingly, there are LaTeX packages for coffee stains[1] and to simulate the variability of an actual typewriter[2]. I suppose both of these involve discrete objects (the coffee stain, individual characters) and photocopy/scan effects involve 'fuzzing' of the whole image, rather than any particular element, and TeX isn't really set up for the former. [1] http://hanno-rein.de/archives/349 http://hanno-rein.de/archives/349 [2] http://mirrors.concertpass.com/tex-archive/macros/luatex/latex/typewriter/typewriter-guide.pdf http://mirrors.concertpass.com/tex-archive/macros/luatex/lat...
- centimeter 6y ago
  What do you use to sign PDFs on your iPad?
  - baicunko 6y ago
    I just use my regular Good Notes 5 app and then export back the PDF
gumby 6y ago
Banks that need monthly financials to assure regulators that they are servicing their loans are also required to justify the documents to the regulator. If you just autogenerated it perhaps they’re wrong or falsified. While if you have to take out a pen and sign them that won’t happen. Yes, absurd.
- pmiller2 6y ago
  That's beyond absurd. The content of the document is what determines whether it's falsified or not, and you can inspect the content for inconsistencies on a generated PDF far more easily than a scanned one.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - gumby 6y ago
    In this case I think it’s the business auditors (pwc etc) assuring “best practices” that will satisfy the regulators and thus the regulatory auditors (Federal reserve, treasury, FDIC...). Banks are themselves full of absurd practices but in this one tiny area I’d give them a pass.
    - kube-system 6y ago
      Yes, this is a lawyers version of a patch to fix bugs that programmers sometimes introduce. A couple of years ago I used DocuSign on a contract, and the PDF “copy” I was emailed as a receipt had different terms than the one I actually signed. Luckily I did not object to the discrepancy, but I would have wondered what would have actually happened if I did.
      - gumby 6y ago
        What?? Is this public? Have others reported this happening? That would be a huge issue!
BillinghamJ 6y ago
Some types of documents/deeds do require "wet ink" signatures by law - https://www.lawsociety.org.uk/support-services/advice/articles/signing-and-exchanging-documents/ https://www.lawsociety.org.uk/support-services/advice/articl...
- yosito 6y ago
  7 years of being a digital nomad, and signing every document digitally, and I never ran into this. TIL.
  - blaser-waffle 6y ago
    Unless there is a serious challenge to the contract no one cares. You obviously are okay with the contract and are signing it (if only in an obfuscated, non-physical sense), and they're just looking for a signature that could be kinda real -- if you're good with the deal, and they're good, who cares?
- lilyball 6y ago
  But scanning these documents defeats the point. The law isn't saying "it must be signed with wet ink, but after that a scanned copy is sufficient", it says you need the actual paper with the wet ink signature. > If you’re a solicitor responsible for registration, you need the other parties' solicitors, on closing, to send you the wet-ink signed parts of the documents. You’ll only proceed when you have the wet-ink signed documents, not when you have seen electronic images of them.

I usually sign documents on my iPad but in this case they told me the signature had to be from a pen. COVID and everything means I don't have a printer nor a scanner at home so I developed this to "scan my iPad signed documents" worked like a charm!

pmiller2 6y ago
As a technological toy, I think this sort of thing is cool. In fact, you can do it in LaTeX pretty easily: https://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/94523/simulate-a-scanned-paper https://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/94523/simulate-a-sca... It's interesting that the problem they had was with the signature. You can very easily make a handwritten signature on an iPad. I don't see how there's any practical way to tell the difference between a high-quality, handwritten signature done on an iPad with either a finger or an Apple Pencil and a scanned signature done with a pen. Are you sure that's not just some excuse they gave you?
- miles 6y ago
  > you can do it in LaTeX pretty easily: https://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/94523/simulate-a-scanned-paper https://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/94523/simulate-a-sca... Ironically, despite being hosted on tex.stackexchange.com, all of the answers use ImageMagick, Photoshop, or Windows 10/Adobe Acrobat.
  - _emacsomancer_ 6y ago
    Interestingly, there are LaTeX packages for coffee stains[1] and to simulate the variability of an actual typewriter[2]. I suppose both of these involve discrete objects (the coffee stain, individual characters) and photocopy/scan effects involve 'fuzzing' of the whole image, rather than any particular element, and TeX isn't really set up for the former. [1] http://hanno-rein.de/archives/349 http://hanno-rein.de/archives/349 [2] http://mirrors.concertpass.com/tex-archive/macros/luatex/latex/typewriter/typewriter-guide.pdf http://mirrors.concertpass.com/tex-archive/macros/luatex/lat...
centimeter 6y ago
What do you use to sign PDFs on your iPad?
- baicunko 6y ago
  I just use my regular Good Notes 5 app and then export back the PDF

gumby 6y ago

Banks that need monthly financials to assure regulators that they are servicing their loans are also required to justify the documents to the regulator. If you just autogenerated it perhaps they’re wrong or falsified. While if you have to take out a pen and sign them that won’t happen. Yes, absurd.

pmiller2 6y ago
That's beyond absurd. The content of the document is what determines whether it's falsified or not, and you can inspect the content for inconsistencies on a generated PDF far more easily than a scanned one.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- gumby 6y ago
  In this case I think it’s the business auditors (pwc etc) assuring “best practices” that will satisfy the regulators and thus the regulatory auditors (Federal reserve, treasury, FDIC...). Banks are themselves full of absurd practices but in this one tiny area I’d give them a pass.
  - kube-system 6y ago
    Yes, this is a lawyers version of a patch to fix bugs that programmers sometimes introduce. A couple of years ago I used DocuSign on a contract, and the PDF “copy” I was emailed as a receipt had different terms than the one I actually signed. Luckily I did not object to the discrepancy, but I would have wondered what would have actually happened if I did.
    - gumby 6y ago
      What?? Is this public? Have others reported this happening? That would be a huge issue!

BillinghamJ 6y ago

Some types of documents/deeds do require "wet ink" signatures by law - https://www.lawsociety.org.uk/support-services/advice/articles/signing-and-exchanging-documents/ https://www.lawsociety.org.uk/support-services/advice/articl...

yosito 6y ago
7 years of being a digital nomad, and signing every document digitally, and I never ran into this. TIL.
- blaser-waffle 6y ago
  Unless there is a serious challenge to the contract no one cares. You obviously are okay with the contract and are signing it (if only in an obfuscated, non-physical sense), and they're just looking for a signature that could be kinda real -- if you're good with the deal, and they're good, who cares?
lilyball 6y ago
But scanning these documents defeats the point. The law isn't saying "it must be signed with wet ink, but after that a scanned copy is sufficient", it says you need the actual paper with the wet ink signature. > If you’re a solicitor responsible for registration, you need the other parties' solicitors, on closing, to send you the wet-ink signed parts of the documents. You’ll only proceed when you have the wet-ink signed documents, not when you have seen electronic images of them.