3 ms·

They have lots of copyrighted content. Such as virtually every commercial retro video game ever made it seems. I personally think it’s great but surely compani

by city41 6y ago

They have lots of copyrighted content. Such as virtually every commercial retro video game ever made it seems. I personally think it’s great but surely companies aren’t too pleased? How does archive.org avoid being sued into oblivion?

judge2020 6y ago
It's a non-profit library and they don't publicly provide a way to download most of the copyrighted content, so rights holders aren't too concerned. I imagine most people, even copyright lawyers, personally support the free archiving of everything made in the current age as long as it doesn't detract from current business operations and the copyrights are respected for their duration.
- city41 6y ago
  It's very easy to download the copyrighted content. For example, here is a full NES ROM set: https://archive.org/details/NESrompack https://archive.org/details/NESrompack
beerandt 6y ago
As far as I know, they limit public access to basically any material with a complaint or request, but keep copies. They may do more, but that seems to be the default response. Which seems smart enough: minimize litigation costs while not losing content permanently via court orders or dmcas or similar threats. But it's frustrating for the wayback machine- where sites like Snopes and some newspapers have opted out of having their history published (after being accused of ghost edits to articles). I don't know what the right answer is, but even if they didn't display the page, it would be nice to see the diffs (ala wikipedia), or at least show if and when changes to a page were made. Maybe that's beyond their mission scope, though.
- TeMPOraL 6y ago
  > sites like Snopes and some newspapers have opted out of having their history published (after being accused of ghost edits to articles) Is there any way to interpret this behavior as anything other than straight up admitting to being dishonest? Especially in context of accusations that could be easily disproved using the Wayback Machine... unless there is something to those accusations, that is.
Paul-ish 6y ago
There are exemptions to DMCA for certain content. > Computer programs and video games distributed in formats that have become obsolete and which require the original media or hardware as a condition of access. A format shall be considered obsolete if the machine or system necessary to render perceptible a work stored in that format is no longer manufactured or is no longer reasonably available in the commercial marketplace. https://www.copyright.gov/1201/2003/index.html https://www.copyright.gov/1201/2003/index.html
- city41 6y ago
  That doesn't seem to stop Nintendo from shutting down ROM sites left and right. For example, emuparadise has complied and taken down all ROMs: https://www.emuparadise.me/emuparadise-changing.php https://www.emuparadise.me/emuparadise-changing.php But here is a complete NES ROM set, just sitting there, on archive.org: https://archive.org/details/NESrompack https://archive.org/details/NESrompack I just find it strange. Nintendo is vehement about their IP. For archive.org to get an exception doesn't make sense to me.
  - Paul-ish 6y ago
    You raise good points. I wonder what a copyright lawyer would have to say.
  - scintill76 6y ago
    (IANAL) Circumventing DRM is usually illegal under DMCA. That quote allows circumventing obsolete DRM. NES cartridge ROM data is still covered by copyright though. I don't know how archive.org gets away with that.

by city41 6y ago

judge2020 6y ago

It's a non-profit library and they don't publicly provide a way to download most of the copyrighted content, so rights holders aren't too concerned. I imagine most people, even copyright lawyers, personally support the free archiving of everything made in the current age as long as it doesn't detract from current business operations and the copyrights are respected for their duration.

city41 6y ago
It's very easy to download the copyrighted content. For example, here is a full NES ROM set: https://archive.org/details/NESrompack https://archive.org/details/NESrompack

beerandt 6y ago

As far as I know, they limit public access to basically any material with a complaint or request, but keep copies. They may do more, but that seems to be the default response. Which seems smart enough: minimize litigation costs while not losing content permanently via court orders or dmcas or similar threats. But it's frustrating for the wayback machine- where sites like Snopes and some newspapers have opted out of having their history published (after being accused of ghost edits to articles). I don't know what the right answer is, but even if they didn't display the page, it would be nice to see the diffs (ala wikipedia), or at least show if and when changes to a page were made. Maybe that's beyond their mission scope, though.

TeMPOraL 6y ago
> sites like Snopes and some newspapers have opted out of having their history published (after being accused of ghost edits to articles) Is there any way to interpret this behavior as anything other than straight up admitting to being dishonest? Especially in context of accusations that could be easily disproved using the Wayback Machine... unless there is something to those accusations, that is.

Paul-ish 6y ago

There are exemptions to DMCA for certain content. > Computer programs and video games distributed in formats that have become obsolete and which require the original media or hardware as a condition of access. A format shall be considered obsolete if the machine or system necessary to render perceptible a work stored in that format is no longer manufactured or is no longer reasonably available in the commercial marketplace. https://www.copyright.gov/1201/2003/index.html https://www.copyright.gov/1201/2003/index.html

city41 6y ago
That doesn't seem to stop Nintendo from shutting down ROM sites left and right. For example, emuparadise has complied and taken down all ROMs: https://www.emuparadise.me/emuparadise-changing.php https://www.emuparadise.me/emuparadise-changing.php But here is a complete NES ROM set, just sitting there, on archive.org: https://archive.org/details/NESrompack https://archive.org/details/NESrompack I just find it strange. Nintendo is vehement about their IP. For archive.org to get an exception doesn't make sense to me.
- Paul-ish 6y ago
  You raise good points. I wonder what a copyright lawyer would have to say.
- scintill76 6y ago
  (IANAL) Circumventing DRM is usually illegal under DMCA. That quote allows circumventing obsolete DRM. NES cartridge ROM data is still covered by copyright though. I don't know how archive.org gets away with that.