4 ms·

A lot of those superstars would love to get out of California if they would get the same salary in absolute amount. Usually companies make the mistake of ,,adju

A lot of those superstars would love to get out of California if they would get the same salary in absolute amount. Usually companies make the mistake of ,,adjusting for cost of living'', and then of course they will find most talent in the most expensive cities.

stu2b50 7y ago
I disagree, I think people underestimate the social cost of uprooting your life, leaving all of your friends and families, and moving into an area that often has beliefs counter to your own There's already examples. Epic will pay you top tech level salaries in the middle of nowhere, where you can live like a king. Superstars seem to be staying put.
- mrep 7y ago
  Epic systems (?) because levels.fyi says otherwise.
- dkersten 7y ago
  > I disagree, I think people underestimate the social cost of uprooting your life, leaving all of your friends and families, and moving into an area that often has beliefs counter to your own You mean how a lot of people do to move to SV in the first place?
- hckr_news 7y ago
  Epic will also make you work with proprietary older tools and languages that leave you lacking if you were to leave in search of another job. Ever heard of MUMPS?
  - goda90 7y ago
    Epic does use newer stuff now too, btw. .NET for instance.
- xiphias2 7y ago
  I don't know Epic, but Basecamp pays SF rates for remote workers, and their retention statistics are far above average. ,,Middle of nowhere'' is a bad place anyways, I'm sure that there are more fun places than Mountain View for young guys to live their single life or to buy their dream family house.
- BurningFrog 7y ago
  And yet probably 1/3 of SV engineers are immigrants, who have done some serious uprooting to be here.
- thu2111 7y ago
  It's interesting how that looks from outside the USA. The first time I went to Mountain View I got a shock. I was young and naive, fresh off the boat from Europe, and I'd been told it was the "City of Mountain View". So I didn't bother renting a car. I figured I'd just take the train. For a lot of people living in the Bay Area is kinda like living in the middle of nowhere. You have to drive for over an hour, often much more if the highways are jammed, simply to reach the nearest actual city. It appears Epic is based in Verona, Wisconsin, which is about 2hr 20 mins from Chicago. So a bit further out for sure, but not so radically different that it'd completely change your life, I guess. Of course if you live in SF and then commute to work, it's different, but that's a pretty miserable experience.
  - cameronbrown 7y ago
    I can't drive, so Uber was a lifesaver in the Bay Area.
chrischen 7y ago
There are probably few other single cities that would be as competitive, even if most people would rather be elsewhere (they’d all be different places).
yumraj 7y ago
After seeing how other states, and populations, have been handling and reacting to the shelter in home policies, I doubt I'll be moving out of CA anytime soon. I just hope the folks I know for example in Texas are able to stay safe.
- DuskStar 7y ago
  ... because they've been too aggressive, or too passive? I'm still in the "there shouldn't be a lockdown for healthy people under 50" camp (since IFR is so low for that demographic), but I could see people being mad at states for the opposite reason, too.
  - yumraj 7y ago
    Texas is already opening up. Not sure about other states. People under 50, including kids, may not die in high numbers but they can still make others sick.
    - DuskStar 7y ago
      As far as I'm aware, there's three ways that a lockdown can save lives - one is to reduce deaths caused by an overwhelmed health care system, another is to delay things until a paradigm shift occurs (for instance, a vaccine or miracle cure), and the third is to stomp out the disease entirely. The first has been achieved - with a small margin in NYC, but far larger margins elsewhere. The second will take another year at the most optimistic. The third would also take a year+ at current lockdown effectiveness levels - but I'd expect mass disobedience before then. * * * And that is why I'd prefer to have lockdowns lifted for lower-risk populations. Yes, people in contact with the old or at-risk should stay in lockdown - but that does not mean that college students, or young families, or a variety of other groups should not return to normal. The more people that are infected, the lower effective r_0 drops (this is how herd immunity works) and the sooner the world can be made safe for at-risk populations. The fact that this might also let the US avoid an economic downturn that makes the Great Depression look merciful is also a major plus. (Current US unemployment is estimated at around 20% - the Great Depression peaked around 25%)

stu2b50 7y ago

I disagree, I think people underestimate the social cost of uprooting your life, leaving all of your friends and families, and moving into an area that often has beliefs counter to your own There's already examples. Epic will pay you top tech level salaries in the middle of nowhere, where you can live like a king. Superstars seem to be staying put.

mrep 7y ago
Epic systems (?) because levels.fyi says otherwise.
dkersten 7y ago
> I disagree, I think people underestimate the social cost of uprooting your life, leaving all of your friends and families, and moving into an area that often has beliefs counter to your own You mean how a lot of people do to move to SV in the first place?
hckr_news 7y ago
Epic will also make you work with proprietary older tools and languages that leave you lacking if you were to leave in search of another job. Ever heard of MUMPS?
- goda90 7y ago
  Epic does use newer stuff now too, btw. .NET for instance.
xiphias2 7y ago
I don't know Epic, but Basecamp pays SF rates for remote workers, and their retention statistics are far above average. ,,Middle of nowhere'' is a bad place anyways, I'm sure that there are more fun places than Mountain View for young guys to live their single life or to buy their dream family house.
BurningFrog 7y ago
And yet probably 1/3 of SV engineers are immigrants, who have done some serious uprooting to be here.
thu2111 7y ago
It's interesting how that looks from outside the USA. The first time I went to Mountain View I got a shock. I was young and naive, fresh off the boat from Europe, and I'd been told it was the "City of Mountain View". So I didn't bother renting a car. I figured I'd just take the train. For a lot of people living in the Bay Area is kinda like living in the middle of nowhere. You have to drive for over an hour, often much more if the highways are jammed, simply to reach the nearest actual city. It appears Epic is based in Verona, Wisconsin, which is about 2hr 20 mins from Chicago. So a bit further out for sure, but not so radically different that it'd completely change your life, I guess. Of course if you live in SF and then commute to work, it's different, but that's a pretty miserable experience.
- cameronbrown 7y ago
  I can't drive, so Uber was a lifesaver in the Bay Area.

chrischen 7y ago

There are probably few other single cities that would be as competitive, even if most people would rather be elsewhere (they’d all be different places).

yumraj 7y ago

After seeing how other states, and populations, have been handling and reacting to the shelter in home policies, I doubt I'll be moving out of CA anytime soon. I just hope the folks I know for example in Texas are able to stay safe.

DuskStar 7y ago
... because they've been too aggressive, or too passive? I'm still in the "there shouldn't be a lockdown for healthy people under 50" camp (since IFR is so low for that demographic), but I could see people being mad at states for the opposite reason, too.
- yumraj 7y ago
  Texas is already opening up. Not sure about other states. People under 50, including kids, may not die in high numbers but they can still make others sick.
  - DuskStar 7y ago
    As far as I'm aware, there's three ways that a lockdown can save lives - one is to reduce deaths caused by an overwhelmed health care system, another is to delay things until a paradigm shift occurs (for instance, a vaccine or miracle cure), and the third is to stomp out the disease entirely. The first has been achieved - with a small margin in NYC, but far larger margins elsewhere. The second will take another year at the most optimistic. The third would also take a year+ at current lockdown effectiveness levels - but I'd expect mass disobedience before then. * * * And that is why I'd prefer to have lockdowns lifted for lower-risk populations. Yes, people in contact with the old or at-risk should stay in lockdown - but that does not mean that college students, or young families, or a variety of other groups should not return to normal. The more people that are infected, the lower effective r_0 drops (this is how herd immunity works) and the sooner the world can be made safe for at-risk populations. The fact that this might also let the US avoid an economic downturn that makes the Great Depression look merciful is also a major plus. (Current US unemployment is estimated at around 20% - the Great Depression peaked around 25%)