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I've lived in LA. I've also lived in Seoul. I miss living in LA. I do not miss living in Seoul. Seoul is a concrete jungle where the vast majority of people li

I've lived in LA. I've also lived in Seoul. I miss living in LA. I do not miss living in Seoul. Seoul is a concrete jungle where the vast majority of people live in tiny concrete apartments. (Literally concrete, I destroyed a lot of masonry drill bits trying to hang pictures on the concrete walls of our apartment.) Sure the subway network in Seoul is extensive but it's still not exactly a fast way to travel. Speaking from experience the fastest way to get around Seoul is on a scooter. That's because scooters routinely jump red lights, go the wrong way down one-way streets and take shortcuts on sidewalks with impunity. Lots of fun when you're young with no kids, as I was at the time, but it doesn't scale and would never be allowed in LA. The easiest way to cut down on vehicle traffic is to stop forcing people commuting to workplaces where they sit down at an internet connected computer that they could just as easily do at home. As the current pandemic has forced so many of us to do, which is one big upside.

lukeschlather 6y ago
What do you mean when you say it "doesn't scale?" * Seoul has twice the population density of LA. * Seoul has less than half the number of road fatalities per 100,000 people. The point about "not a fast way to travel" is interesting but it's also worth recognizing that with double the population density there are twice as many destinations to visit, so that can be deceptive when you look at trip length. If there are 5 grocery stores within 5km vs. 5 grocery stores within 10km, it doesn't matter at all if it takes twice as long to travel 5km in the former case, it's equivalent. (And it's more likely you can do it on foot, which is healthier in terms of lower pollution, more exercise, and fewer road fatalities.)
culturestate 6y ago
I tend to agree; if the author wants to look at any Asian capitals as a model, Tokyo and Singapore would seem like better choices. Both feel substantially less claustrophobic than Seoul or Hong Kong, and I think Singapore fits especially well with its emphasis on quality of life factors. Instead of maximizing land utilization, for example, most residential buildings make allowance for amenities like gardens and pools. The government encourages (and in some cases, subsidizes) mixed-use development and has aggressive targets for increasing the already considerable amount of green space in the city. Frankly, at street level, there are a lot of places where you'd have a difficult time telling the difference between Singapore and LA or Miami.
yongjik 6y ago
What? Most of these scooter riders are trying to deliver something: they aren't the usual method of transport for most people in Seoul. Seoul also has extensive road system, including two freeways cutting through it from end to end (one on either side of the Han River), and one highway that goes around the city in a full circle. They are pretty heavily used. A lot of people still take subways because it's the most convenient for many destinations. Without subways, these highways will grind to a traffic hell.
summerlight 6y ago
> Speaking from experience the fastest way to get around Seoul is on a scooter. This is a pretty bold claim and I don't think you can get agreements from the majority of Seoul citizens. I lived in Seoul over 30 years and I usually could access most of the "downtown" within half an hour by a combination of bus and subway. It's been a while after me leaving there, so I guess the situation should be further improved. I don't know why you're even mentioning scooters as it's meant for delivery in the context of Seoul, not for a typical mode of transportation.

lukeschlather 6y ago

What do you mean when you say it "doesn't scale?" * Seoul has twice the population density of LA. * Seoul has less than half the number of road fatalities per 100,000 people. The point about "not a fast way to travel" is interesting but it's also worth recognizing that with double the population density there are twice as many destinations to visit, so that can be deceptive when you look at trip length. If there are 5 grocery stores within 5km vs. 5 grocery stores within 10km, it doesn't matter at all if it takes twice as long to travel 5km in the former case, it's equivalent. (And it's more likely you can do it on foot, which is healthier in terms of lower pollution, more exercise, and fewer road fatalities.)

culturestate 6y ago

I tend to agree; if the author wants to look at any Asian capitals as a model, Tokyo and Singapore would seem like better choices. Both feel substantially less claustrophobic than Seoul or Hong Kong, and I think Singapore fits especially well with its emphasis on quality of life factors. Instead of maximizing land utilization, for example, most residential buildings make allowance for amenities like gardens and pools. The government encourages (and in some cases, subsidizes) mixed-use development and has aggressive targets for increasing the already considerable amount of green space in the city. Frankly, at street level, there are a lot of places where you'd have a difficult time telling the difference between Singapore and LA or Miami.

yongjik 6y ago

What? Most of these scooter riders are trying to deliver something: they aren't the usual method of transport for most people in Seoul. Seoul also has extensive road system, including two freeways cutting through it from end to end (one on either side of the Han River), and one highway that goes around the city in a full circle. They are pretty heavily used. A lot of people still take subways because it's the most convenient for many destinations. Without subways, these highways will grind to a traffic hell.

summerlight 6y ago

> Speaking from experience the fastest way to get around Seoul is on a scooter. This is a pretty bold claim and I don't think you can get agreements from the majority of Seoul citizens. I lived in Seoul over 30 years and I usually could access most of the "downtown" within half an hour by a combination of bus and subway. It's been a while after me leaving there, so I guess the situation should be further improved. I don't know why you're even mentioning scooters as it's meant for delivery in the context of Seoul, not for a typical mode of transportation.