13 ms·

Analysis of dev agencies with hourly rates, team size and tech stack

227 points by tombrm 6y ago

lvice 6y ago
Hourly rates seem very off for Italy as well, as the real average is much much lower to the declared $80/hr (web&software). It is especially suspicious that France ($64/hr) and Germany ($55/hr) have a much lower hourly rate, when in reality salaries and rates in these countries are at least 20-30% higher than Italy.
- yulaow 6y ago
  Agencies like Reply, Accenture, Avanade and Engineering are quite overcharging other companies for their consultants in Italy, taking advantage of the fact that a lot of big companies are hostile to keep devs in house (almost all of the big banks for example). I had the chance to see for how much I was being sold as a consultant some years ago and it was almost 3x the salary I was going to get (3 x 32k before taxes).
  - txcwpalpha 6y ago
    Lot's of commenters in this thread are trying to draw conclusions about dev salaries from this data, but you really can't do that for exactly the reasons you described. It gets even more disproportional for some of the bigger, high price tag consulting firms. In the Big 4 it's common to have entry level devs making $80k/yr ($~40ish/hr) while being billed out to customers at $200-300/hr.
  - lvice 6y ago
    I work in one of the companies you mentioned in Italy and, although it's true what you said, the rate paid by the customer still is around 350-550 Euro/day, which is $46-$73/hr, and these are the rates at top tier consultancy companies. $80/hr average still seems very high to me.
ravedave5 6y ago
Page layout is not great, got to the end and saw founders pictures so I thought that was the whole article. I'm interested so I reopened to double check and there's more on the left.
- jolmg 6y ago
  Yeah, I would have missed it too, if you hadn't mentioned it. The sidebar is not visible unless the browser is fullscreen. That's fine, but then the button on the bottom that continues to "II. Mobile dev agencies >>" should be above the founder pictures. That way, it'd be clear to those who the sidebar is not presented to that the content continues. If that's not appropriate because the founder pictures are meant to be part of the content, then perhaps they should be on the last page, because it does kind of signal the end.
- cableshaft 6y ago
  Thanks for mentioning this, I thought the same until I saw your comment. Not the best design.
- superasn 6y ago
  Yeah i was feeling so out of the loop wondering wth everyone is taking about.. where is the carousel? Checked the page 2 times before I saw that button under everything else. It looks like the sort of thing companies do when they don't want you to click on something! It's such a bad theme. edit: after checking out the entire article now, it is quite insightful to be honest. Lots of interesting research and data. I think they should just make a simple html version like the craigslist website and it will be a super hit.
quxbar 6y ago
Is developer pay in Cyprus and Malaysia really so great, or do a few digital nomads just have their lives really well optimized?
- notdang 6y ago
  That's not the salary. That's how much the agency is charging for them.
  - commandlinefan 6y ago
    I did a stint as a "contractor" at a body-shop consultancy back in the 90's, only a few years out of college. Although they did pay well compared to what I could get as a perm employee, they were charging THREE TIMES what they were paying me. The friction that this caused was a deal breaker: the project manager knew that I was costing as much as quadruple what their ordinary employees were costing them, and expected 4x the output.
    - pc86 6y ago
      3x seems reasonable. I've subcontracted out to folks, and even at a 2x markup, with the coordination, review, and other unbillable activities I made almost no profit. As a percentage, it was barely worth even having the initial leverage and I rarely did it (at 2x markup) unless it was strictly to meet a deadline. In large orgs where profit is a requirement for just about every interaction I can see how 3x or 4x would be necessary to justify doing the work in the first place.
    - txcwpalpha 6y ago
      IME this is very common and in some situations can be beneficial for everyone involved. The company hiring the consultants get the flexibility of being able to quickly hire you/fire you if needed, rather than going through a lengthy recruiting/hiring/firing process. They pay the premium for it, but it can be worth it. Then the consulting agency obviously makes a nice profit off of it. And then the consultant themselves can usually benefit from it as well, because typically they get a higher wage than the average employee to begin with, and also it becomes a very easy conversation to have with the company "just hire me as a FTE instead of paying the consulting company. My salary is currently $50/hr, you're paying them $150/hr for my work. Instead you can just pay me $100/hr, and we both benefit." I've seen a lot of consultant -> FTE transitions happen like that. That only does work if the company is actually looking for a long-term FTE, though. Like I mentioned above, a lot of the time the company is paying the premium in the first place is so that they can quickly and easily drop you off their payroll if needed. They lose out on that by bringing you on as FTE.
Etheryte 6y ago
Given how wildly the framework usage [1] differs from the long-standing and well known State of JS survey results [2], I'd be fairly wary of anything else they claim. Not saying the results are wrong, probably just different samples, more so that it seems the variance is way too high to get any useful insights. [1] https://devquarterly.com/report/q2_2020/web#developers_working_with_certain_frameworks_and_libraries https://devquarterly.com/report/q2_2020/web#developers_worki... [2] https://2019.stateofjs.com/front-end-frameworks/ https://2019.stateofjs.com/front-end-frameworks/
- dan-robertson 6y ago
  The survey in this article claims to have reached about 1000 times more people (though not all JS devs) than the stateofjs survey. I would expect some differences due to selection bias
- klohto 6y ago
  This is a report for agencies. They cover a completely different set of customers and most of the time are called in to maintain. Maintaining leaves a little space to introduce new technologies and processes, which leaves you with older technologies. Also, these companies have no reason to switch to other (newer/shinier) technologies since the software they deliver is tied closely with the chosen language. Switching would mean finding new customers.
- IggleSniggle 6y ago
  State of JS is also biased to the group that opts to fill the State of JS survey. I do think it's a great survey with real value, but it's quite likely it's own distinct group too.
andrewon 6y ago
An example of bias sampling? Better to stratify geographical regions.
qaq 6y ago
some numbers are really off Ukraine is over 100k
- nwsm 6y ago
  Yeah.. headcount by country isn't a very useful stat in an analysis like this that is obviously non-exhaustive and potentially biased in selection.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
jen140 6y ago
India with 36$/hour in "web and software developers", is it correct ? Portugal with 37$, never seen such salaries here..
- nwsm 6y ago
  As someone else mentioned, that is the rate the company charges, not what the dev is paid.
neomindryan 6y ago
Anyone know why they gave a whole section to "Web" and omitted Ruby? Even C and Visual Basic are present.
- hpoe 6y ago
  They were jealous of how easy to use and beautiful Ruby is.
- toyg 6y ago
  Because Ruby is dead, Netcraft confirmed it. /s
- timdorr 6y ago
  Because these are agencies. They're often called in to maintain legacy systems, which don't get to use shiny new tech. Hence low or missing numbers for things like Ruby or React, despite their prevalence otherwise.
  - burlesona 6y ago
    Sadly, that would actually point the other direction. Ruby was red-hot circa 2010, and while it’s still widely used, it’s not the new shiny thing anymore. I would expect to see more “legacy maintenance” Ruby work than brand-new ruby work these days.
  - jrumbut 6y ago
    I only have anecdata but all that I have of it points to agencies being heavy Ruby/Rails users and React as well. Both of them work well since they impose a structure and programming model that basically works for a lot of business software, so you can focus on the domain problems and move quickly over the standard tasks like an asset pipeline or account management.
  - duhi88 6y ago
    Ruby is definitely not new and shiny. There are plenty of long-lived Ruby on Rails projects that need to be maintained. Makes sense not seeing React, though. It is far more complicated and fragile to get SEO-friendly pages rendered with React (and there aren't many legacy systems that use it, either).
realtalk_sp 6y ago
The whole site offers a poor UX with weird redundancies, terrible navigation, grammatical errors, etc. It's probably sensible to conclude the methods used to gather, clean, and present the data are correspondingly untrustworthy.
vmception 6y ago
I really like this! It is so hard to find and compare Solidity and Truffle developers for the EVM
vmception 6y ago
I wish someone would do this for legal work. I always felt there could be similar plot charts to help reveal the outcome of wildly different needs, and still give a feel for what to expect
sacks2k 6y ago
I oversee the hiring of dev shops for a mid-sized company in the US and the rates for e-commerce/web development are all in the $120-$150/hour range. The funny thing is that some of these companies outsourced to the Ukraine and India and the rates didn't change. I would have thought that we would at least see some of the cost savings. Both companies that outsourced ended up being complete disasters (we are still cleaning up the technical debt 3+ years later), which happened before I was involved. Since this is the case, it made no sense to hire any company that didn't hire all developers directly in the US or Canada (which is now a requirement). I suppose I should thank these companies, because it's the reason I have a job today.
- danans 6y ago
  > The funny thing is that some of these companies outsourced to the Ukraine and India and the rates didn't change. I would have thought that we would at least see some of the cost savings. Why would the rates be lower if the market is one where demand for labor exceeds supply? It's not like lowering the rate is going to allow them to sell more hours, since they are still constrained by human capacity. If the quality of the work was not good, that's a different issue.
- tootie 6y ago
  Are these freelancer rates or bill rates to clients? Usually there's at least a 20% margin added to bill rates by agencies.
  - yourapostasy 6y ago
    In this kind of discussion context, typically the OP's rates are the bill rates to clients (the OP's company). I normally see the smaller agencies clear 40-50% margin, and the big names are clearing 50-80%, so I wouldn't be surprised if those agencies in Ukraine and India were paying their teams in the $60-75 per hour USD range at most, which is considered really good in those parts of the world.
    - rakamotog 6y ago
jdxcode 6y ago
How is Andorra the 9th top country for agency workers? A country of 77k people has 15k agency workers?
- mbdesign 6y ago
  My impression is that Andorra has a favourable tax regime and is close to Spain and France...
  - jdxcode 6y ago
    that's over 20% of every person (including children and the elderly) and the wikipedia page doesn't even mention software.
    - Apocryphon 6y ago
      It's like how every company is incorporated in Delaware and has an "office" in the Caymans.
numbsafari 6y ago
I’m confused ... this says Andorra has >15k people working at dev agencies. The country has a total population of <100k, most of whom work in the tourism industry. I feel like these numbers don’t add up.
- Itaxpica 6y ago
  Yeah, this sounds like an artifact of some kind of tax shenanigans rather than a real number
  - moltar 6y ago
    Doubt it. Andorra’s official numbers are still under 100k residents even counting the for-tax-purposes residents. There are for sure not 15k devs there. I’ve been to Andorra and visited a few meetups. They had very few people in attendance.
    - numbsafari 6y ago
      Yeah, I'm thinking the simpler answer here is that this data is basically trash. Based on some of the other comments in this thread, it really seems like it is not a good quality survey with pretty poor quality control. It reports fewer agency developers in China than in Andorra. The difference between the two represents 1% of Andorra's total population and 0.7E-4% of China's.
chrismorgan 6y ago
Something really, really annoying about this site: it uses automatically-progressing carousels that cause content reflow below them in the page. I encounter this sort of thing so often, and it’s really, really bad. Positively awful. Super disconcerting. In most cases like this, it’s just that one slide is longer than the others. In this case, there are a couple like that, but also for the rest, image tags have been used without specifying their dimensions, so they take up no space as the carousel slide enters, and then once the image starts loading they reflow instantaneously as the dimenions are known. Please, if you have a carousel, you must make sure that its height never changes as it progresses. (And please always put width and height on your images, too, so the intrinsic aspect ratio can be applied properly.) Oh, and auto-progressing carousels as a whole are a blight, but a sometimes-just-barely-tolerable one. So long as they’ll just stop progressing once I interact with them! Please! Does anyone like carousels? I encounter software developers railing against them, I encounter normal people railing against them (from recently, a non-techie had one request about a new site, that the carousel inserted by the developer of the prototype—because it was a part of the WordPress theme used—be removed), I honestly can’t think of having encountered a single person that likes carousels. They’re just all-round irritating.
- vimslayer 6y ago
  http://shouldiuseacarousel.com/ http://shouldiuseacarousel.com/ :)
  - ubercow13 6y ago
    Now I am irritable
  - pier25 6y ago
    I've been saying this for years but marketing guys love carousels. If you can afford to hide content why even put it in the first place? Specially on the most prominent part of your website. If you want to deliver a message focus on essential content that cannot be hidden.
- servercobra 6y ago
  Especially for a site filled with charts. I'm trying to compare some data, and all the sudden the data has moved to a new place. I stopped reading after 2 pages, even though I was very interested in the results. Easily one of the most frustrating sites I've used recently.
bentona 6y ago
It'd be really interesting to see more than just averages for rates. Many dev shops I've interacted with are all right around $250/hr here in the US / on coasts, I wonder if there are similar standards elsewhere, or different tiers in different areas.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
andrewmcwatters 6y ago
These rates are so incredibly off, that this shouldn't be taken seriously.
bgroat 6y ago
Are all of these values in US dollars?
edpichler 6y ago
The first pages made me very skeptical, so I stop to read this. Beyond that there is no data intelligence on these reports, the numbers are weird. It's showing Colombia's hourly rate more expensive than Sweden's. Also, I know very much my homeland market, I am sure that it's wrong. I did not go further.
- sheeshkebab 6y ago
  It’s a clickbait article... any article that claims something about rates, salaries, sales is basically that. They are often completely inaccurate, with data coming from either self reported numbers (best case), or a guess based on a sample of job postings they scraped from somewhere.
  - RonanTheGrey 6y ago
    Yeah, the whole thing looks to be basically an ad for agencies that have registered with them. Nice for the agencies, not all that useful to this crowd for data collection. Alot of the numbers are just way, way off from industry standards so it makes me wonder where they got them.
marceloabsousa 6y ago
Is a dev agency basically a consulting company?
Agoreddah 6y ago
These rates are quite interesting. After I did one freelance project (managed team of 3devs, created prototype of 5G API network component), I am thinking about starting my own small software agency. I was expecting to charge 30-35EUR/hour (Central Europe region), but according to these rates, my expectations are quite low. Can anyone give me any advice, books or podcasts, how to get better in business negotiation, to be more confident to ask a proper charge?

227 points by tombrm 6y ago

Hourly rates seem very off for Italy as well, as the real average is much much lower to the declared $80/hr (web&software). It is especially suspicious that France ($64/hr) and Germany ($55/hr) have a much lower hourly rate, when in reality salaries and rates in these countries are at least 20-30% higher than Italy.

yulaow 6y ago
Agencies like Reply, Accenture, Avanade and Engineering are quite overcharging other companies for their consultants in Italy, taking advantage of the fact that a lot of big companies are hostile to keep devs in house (almost all of the big banks for example). I had the chance to see for how much I was being sold as a consultant some years ago and it was almost 3x the salary I was going to get (3 x 32k before taxes).
- txcwpalpha 6y ago
  Lot's of commenters in this thread are trying to draw conclusions about dev salaries from this data, but you really can't do that for exactly the reasons you described. It gets even more disproportional for some of the bigger, high price tag consulting firms. In the Big 4 it's common to have entry level devs making $80k/yr ($~40ish/hr) while being billed out to customers at $200-300/hr.
- lvice 6y ago
  I work in one of the companies you mentioned in Italy and, although it's true what you said, the rate paid by the customer still is around 350-550 Euro/day, which is $46-$73/hr, and these are the rates at top tier consultancy companies. $80/hr average still seems very high to me.

ravedave5 6y ago

Page layout is not great, got to the end and saw founders pictures so I thought that was the whole article. I'm interested so I reopened to double check and there's more on the left.

jolmg 6y ago
Yeah, I would have missed it too, if you hadn't mentioned it. The sidebar is not visible unless the browser is fullscreen. That's fine, but then the button on the bottom that continues to "II. Mobile dev agencies >>" should be above the founder pictures. That way, it'd be clear to those who the sidebar is not presented to that the content continues. If that's not appropriate because the founder pictures are meant to be part of the content, then perhaps they should be on the last page, because it does kind of signal the end.
cableshaft 6y ago
Thanks for mentioning this, I thought the same until I saw your comment. Not the best design.
superasn 6y ago
Yeah i was feeling so out of the loop wondering wth everyone is taking about.. where is the carousel? Checked the page 2 times before I saw that button under everything else. It looks like the sort of thing companies do when they don't want you to click on something! It's such a bad theme. edit: after checking out the entire article now, it is quite insightful to be honest. Lots of interesting research and data. I think they should just make a simple html version like the craigslist website and it will be a super hit.

quxbar 6y ago

Is developer pay in Cyprus and Malaysia really so great, or do a few digital nomads just have their lives really well optimized?

notdang 6y ago
That's not the salary. That's how much the agency is charging for them.
- commandlinefan 6y ago
  I did a stint as a "contractor" at a body-shop consultancy back in the 90's, only a few years out of college. Although they did pay well compared to what I could get as a perm employee, they were charging THREE TIMES what they were paying me. The friction that this caused was a deal breaker: the project manager knew that I was costing as much as quadruple what their ordinary employees were costing them, and expected 4x the output.
  - pc86 6y ago
    3x seems reasonable. I've subcontracted out to folks, and even at a 2x markup, with the coordination, review, and other unbillable activities I made almost no profit. As a percentage, it was barely worth even having the initial leverage and I rarely did it (at 2x markup) unless it was strictly to meet a deadline. In large orgs where profit is a requirement for just about every interaction I can see how 3x or 4x would be necessary to justify doing the work in the first place.
  - txcwpalpha 6y ago
    IME this is very common and in some situations can be beneficial for everyone involved. The company hiring the consultants get the flexibility of being able to quickly hire you/fire you if needed, rather than going through a lengthy recruiting/hiring/firing process. They pay the premium for it, but it can be worth it. Then the consulting agency obviously makes a nice profit off of it. And then the consultant themselves can usually benefit from it as well, because typically they get a higher wage than the average employee to begin with, and also it becomes a very easy conversation to have with the company "just hire me as a FTE instead of paying the consulting company. My salary is currently $50/hr, you're paying them $150/hr for my work. Instead you can just pay me $100/hr, and we both benefit." I've seen a lot of consultant -> FTE transitions happen like that. That only does work if the company is actually looking for a long-term FTE, though. Like I mentioned above, a lot of the time the company is paying the premium in the first place is so that they can quickly and easily drop you off their payroll if needed. They lose out on that by bringing you on as FTE.

Etheryte 6y ago

Given how wildly the framework usage [1] differs from the long-standing and well known State of JS survey results [2], I'd be fairly wary of anything else they claim. Not saying the results are wrong, probably just different samples, more so that it seems the variance is way too high to get any useful insights. [1] https://devquarterly.com/report/q2_2020/web#developers_working_with_certain_frameworks_and_libraries https://devquarterly.com/report/q2_2020/web#developers_worki... [2] https://2019.stateofjs.com/front-end-frameworks/ https://2019.stateofjs.com/front-end-frameworks/

dan-robertson 6y ago
The survey in this article claims to have reached about 1000 times more people (though not all JS devs) than the stateofjs survey. I would expect some differences due to selection bias
klohto 6y ago
This is a report for agencies. They cover a completely different set of customers and most of the time are called in to maintain. Maintaining leaves a little space to introduce new technologies and processes, which leaves you with older technologies. Also, these companies have no reason to switch to other (newer/shinier) technologies since the software they deliver is tied closely with the chosen language. Switching would mean finding new customers.
IggleSniggle 6y ago
State of JS is also biased to the group that opts to fill the State of JS survey. I do think it's a great survey with real value, but it's quite likely it's own distinct group too.

andrewon 6y ago

An example of bias sampling? Better to stratify geographical regions.

qaq 6y ago

some numbers are really off Ukraine is over 100k

nwsm 6y ago
Yeah.. headcount by country isn't a very useful stat in an analysis like this that is obviously non-exhaustive and potentially biased in selection.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

jen140 6y ago

India with 36$/hour in "web and software developers", is it correct ? Portugal with 37$, never seen such salaries here..

nwsm 6y ago
As someone else mentioned, that is the rate the company charges, not what the dev is paid.

neomindryan 6y ago

Anyone know why they gave a whole section to "Web" and omitted Ruby? Even C and Visual Basic are present.

hpoe 6y ago
They were jealous of how easy to use and beautiful Ruby is.
toyg 6y ago
Because Ruby is dead, Netcraft confirmed it. /s
timdorr 6y ago
Because these are agencies. They're often called in to maintain legacy systems, which don't get to use shiny new tech. Hence low or missing numbers for things like Ruby or React, despite their prevalence otherwise.
- burlesona 6y ago
  Sadly, that would actually point the other direction. Ruby was red-hot circa 2010, and while it’s still widely used, it’s not the new shiny thing anymore. I would expect to see more “legacy maintenance” Ruby work than brand-new ruby work these days.
- jrumbut 6y ago
  I only have anecdata but all that I have of it points to agencies being heavy Ruby/Rails users and React as well. Both of them work well since they impose a structure and programming model that basically works for a lot of business software, so you can focus on the domain problems and move quickly over the standard tasks like an asset pipeline or account management.
- duhi88 6y ago
  Ruby is definitely not new and shiny. There are plenty of long-lived Ruby on Rails projects that need to be maintained. Makes sense not seeing React, though. It is far more complicated and fragile to get SEO-friendly pages rendered with React (and there aren't many legacy systems that use it, either).

realtalk_sp 6y ago

The whole site offers a poor UX with weird redundancies, terrible navigation, grammatical errors, etc. It's probably sensible to conclude the methods used to gather, clean, and present the data are correspondingly untrustworthy.

vmception 6y ago

I really like this! It is so hard to find and compare Solidity and Truffle developers for the EVM

vmception 6y ago

I wish someone would do this for legal work. I always felt there could be similar plot charts to help reveal the outcome of wildly different needs, and still give a feel for what to expect

sacks2k 6y ago

I oversee the hiring of dev shops for a mid-sized company in the US and the rates for e-commerce/web development are all in the $120-$150/hour range. The funny thing is that some of these companies outsourced to the Ukraine and India and the rates didn't change. I would have thought that we would at least see some of the cost savings. Both companies that outsourced ended up being complete disasters (we are still cleaning up the technical debt 3+ years later), which happened before I was involved. Since this is the case, it made no sense to hire any company that didn't hire all developers directly in the US or Canada (which is now a requirement). I suppose I should thank these companies, because it's the reason I have a job today.

danans 6y ago
> The funny thing is that some of these companies outsourced to the Ukraine and India and the rates didn't change. I would have thought that we would at least see some of the cost savings. Why would the rates be lower if the market is one where demand for labor exceeds supply? It's not like lowering the rate is going to allow them to sell more hours, since they are still constrained by human capacity. If the quality of the work was not good, that's a different issue.
tootie 6y ago
Are these freelancer rates or bill rates to clients? Usually there's at least a 20% margin added to bill rates by agencies.
- yourapostasy 6y ago
  In this kind of discussion context, typically the OP's rates are the bill rates to clients (the OP's company). I normally see the smaller agencies clear 40-50% margin, and the big names are clearing 50-80%, so I wouldn't be surprised if those agencies in Ukraine and India were paying their teams in the $60-75 per hour USD range at most, which is considered really good in those parts of the world.
  - rakamotog 6y ago

jdxcode 6y ago

How is Andorra the 9th top country for agency workers? A country of 77k people has 15k agency workers?

mbdesign 6y ago
My impression is that Andorra has a favourable tax regime and is close to Spain and France...
- jdxcode 6y ago
  that's over 20% of every person (including children and the elderly) and the wikipedia page doesn't even mention software.
  - Apocryphon 6y ago
    It's like how every company is incorporated in Delaware and has an "office" in the Caymans.

numbsafari 6y ago

I’m confused ... this says Andorra has >15k people working at dev agencies. The country has a total population of <100k, most of whom work in the tourism industry. I feel like these numbers don’t add up.

Itaxpica 6y ago
Yeah, this sounds like an artifact of some kind of tax shenanigans rather than a real number
- moltar 6y ago
  Doubt it. Andorra’s official numbers are still under 100k residents even counting the for-tax-purposes residents. There are for sure not 15k devs there. I’ve been to Andorra and visited a few meetups. They had very few people in attendance.
  - numbsafari 6y ago
    Yeah, I'm thinking the simpler answer here is that this data is basically trash. Based on some of the other comments in this thread, it really seems like it is not a good quality survey with pretty poor quality control. It reports fewer agency developers in China than in Andorra. The difference between the two represents 1% of Andorra's total population and 0.7E-4% of China's.

chrismorgan 6y ago

Something really, really annoying about this site: it uses automatically-progressing carousels that cause content reflow below them in the page. I encounter this sort of thing so often, and it’s really, really bad. Positively awful. Super disconcerting. In most cases like this, it’s just that one slide is longer than the others. In this case, there are a couple like that, but also for the rest, image tags have been used without specifying their dimensions, so they take up no space as the carousel slide enters, and then once the image starts loading they reflow instantaneously as the dimenions are known. Please, if you have a carousel, you must make sure that its height never changes as it progresses. (And please always put width and height on your images, too, so the intrinsic aspect ratio can be applied properly.) Oh, and auto-progressing carousels as a whole are a blight, but a sometimes-just-barely-tolerable one. So long as they’ll just stop progressing once I interact with them! Please! Does anyone like carousels? I encounter software developers railing against them, I encounter normal people railing against them (from recently, a non-techie had one request about a new site, that the carousel inserted by the developer of the prototype—because it was a part of the WordPress theme used—be removed), I honestly can’t think of having encountered a single person that likes carousels. They’re just all-round irritating.

vimslayer 6y ago
http://shouldiuseacarousel.com/ http://shouldiuseacarousel.com/ :)
- ubercow13 6y ago
  Now I am irritable
- pier25 6y ago
  I've been saying this for years but marketing guys love carousels. If you can afford to hide content why even put it in the first place? Specially on the most prominent part of your website. If you want to deliver a message focus on essential content that cannot be hidden.
servercobra 6y ago
Especially for a site filled with charts. I'm trying to compare some data, and all the sudden the data has moved to a new place. I stopped reading after 2 pages, even though I was very interested in the results. Easily one of the most frustrating sites I've used recently.

bentona 6y ago

It'd be really interesting to see more than just averages for rates. Many dev shops I've interacted with are all right around $250/hr here in the US / on coasts, I wonder if there are similar standards elsewhere, or different tiers in different areas.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

andrewmcwatters 6y ago

These rates are so incredibly off, that this shouldn't be taken seriously.

bgroat 6y ago

Are all of these values in US dollars?

edpichler 6y ago

The first pages made me very skeptical, so I stop to read this. Beyond that there is no data intelligence on these reports, the numbers are weird. It's showing Colombia's hourly rate more expensive than Sweden's. Also, I know very much my homeland market, I am sure that it's wrong. I did not go further.

sheeshkebab 6y ago
It’s a clickbait article... any article that claims something about rates, salaries, sales is basically that. They are often completely inaccurate, with data coming from either self reported numbers (best case), or a guess based on a sample of job postings they scraped from somewhere.
- RonanTheGrey 6y ago
  Yeah, the whole thing looks to be basically an ad for agencies that have registered with them. Nice for the agencies, not all that useful to this crowd for data collection. Alot of the numbers are just way, way off from industry standards so it makes me wonder where they got them.

marceloabsousa 6y ago

Is a dev agency basically a consulting company?

Agoreddah 6y ago

These rates are quite interesting. After I did one freelance project (managed team of 3devs, created prototype of 5G API network component), I am thinking about starting my own small software agency. I was expecting to charge 30-35EUR/hour (Central Europe region), but according to these rates, my expectations are quite low. Can anyone give me any advice, books or podcasts, how to get better in business negotiation, to be more confident to ask a proper charge?