5 ms·

Main link incl. video: https://www.crowdsupply.com/mnt/reform https://www.crowdsupply.com/mnt/reform Also, AMA!

by mntmn 6y ago

mwcampbell 6y ago
Did you consider using DisplayPort as your, um, display port? Or would that also require a firmware blob?
- mntmn 6y ago
  Requires the same or similar controller blob (Xtensa) as HDMI on i.MX8M. Edit: To explain, the external DP/HDMI TX shares an IP block and even the signal lines. This is also a reason why we’re using a MIPI DSI->eDP converter chip for the internal display, as that path is blob-free. I wish there was a good blob free USB3 display adapter. Maybe we’ll have to make one.
  - fra 6y ago
    Not to sound too negative - I love what you are doing - but using a MIPI DSI -> eDP bridge IC does not get rid of any proprietary blobs. In practice, those bridge ICs contain general purpose MCU cores, and run a proprietary firmware blob. You can usually update it over I2C. So you've just shifted the blob from one part of the stack (AP firmware) to another (bridge IC firmware).
    - mntmn 6y ago
      That is incorrect. There is no updatable firmware blob in the chip that we use: http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/sllseh2b/sllseh2b.pdf?&ts=1588958310547 http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/sllseh2b/sllseh2b.pdf?&ts=158895831...
      - fra 6y ago
        I am very familiar with this IC.
fstephany 6y ago
Following the progress of the Reform project has been fascinating. Thanks a lot for making this and sharing frequent updates :)
armitron 6y ago
I bought your ZZ9000 and I obviously like your work. But I do wish you focused on retro computing. I just can’t see this laptop going anywhere in terms of impact. The field is a black hole that consumes time & effort.
- mntmn 6y ago
  You’re funny.
  - armitron 6y ago
    "I’m funny how, I mean funny like I’m a clown?" In all seriousness, I'd like to support you but I won't, not for this. As somebody else said, in this very thread, it doesn't really stand out and the alternatives are many. Stick to what you do best.
    - mntmn 6y ago
      Don't tell me what to do.
- zenexer 6y ago
  When you say "retro computing", what do you mean? I assume you have something specific in mind, and I'm curious what that is. I don't think your request is particularly relevant to this HN post, though I may be missing the context since I'd never heard of MNT Research prior to today.
mwcampbell 6y ago
It would be nice to have UnixBench scores in your comparison table. I'm guessing the SoC in the reform won't be in the same league as current Intel laptop processors, but it would be nice to have some idea of what we're getting.
- mntmn 6y ago
  OK, I’ll look into that. Is that a good benchmark? Are there other meaningful ones?
  - mwcampbell 6y ago
    What I like about UnixBench is that it covers I/O as well as raw CPU performance. (So you'd want to make sure it uses the SSD, not the SD card.) And it's open source (edit: actually checked the license now; looks like it's GPL2). I'll let others weigh in with other benchmark suggestions.
    - Cyclenerd 6y ago
      UnixBench would be great. I have a bash script that runs several benchmarks and create a website: https://github.com/Cyclenerd/benchmark https://github.com/Cyclenerd/benchmark You would have to remove Geekbench from Line 650 in the source code. Does not work with ARM.
- zenexer 6y ago
  I'd also be curious about approximate battery life. Personally, I'd rather a decent ARM SoC and longer battery life than a beefy x86 CPU that's going to drain the battery in two hours.
georgeoliver 6y ago
Have there been any significant changes since your description of the HW here https://mntre.com/media/reform_md/2020-01-18-finishing-reform.html https://mntre.com/media/reform_md/2020-01-18-finishing-refor...? (also, I just love that you incorporated the trackball, thank you).
zenexer 6y ago
1. Roughly how heavy is it? It looks big but not too dense. 2. How easy is it to remap keys on the keyboard and trackball? For example, I'd probably want to swap the Alt and Space keys, the Shift and Up/Del keys, and the Primary/Secondary Click and macro buttons. Are we talking config file change or manually patching firmware? 3. How generic is the SoM connector? Are there any existing alternative SoMs I might be able to stick in there? 4. How many times can I open the body without running into issues? For example, if I swap out the batteries every day for a year, am I going to run into problems? 5. It looks like you opted for a barrel jack instead of USB-PD for charging. Why'd you choose to go that route? 6. Why the lack of USB Type-C ports? 7. "The keyboard not only works as a USB HID device, but it also has a direct UART cable connection to the system controller on the motherboard. By pressing the Circle key, you can interact directly with the system controller, bypassing the main SoC." That sounds really cool. Do you have more info about that? How hackable is it? Edit: I like where you're going with the project, and I think I could easily turn this into my daily driver. Keep up the great work!
- danbolt 6y ago
  I don't really have MNT's answers to your questions, but I do know that for (7) they have the source for the keyboard firmware on gittea here: https://source.mntmn.com/MNT/reform/src/branch/master/reform2-keyboard-fw https://source.mntmn.com/MNT/reform/src/branch/master/reform...
- mntmn 6y ago
  Thanks for your questions and encouragement. Answers: 1. ~1.9kg fully loaded with batteries, WiFi card and SSD. 2. Currently you need to rebuild the firmware, which is "make" and then "flash.sh", but it's absolutely feasible to make a nice keymap editor. 3. The connector itself is generic and cheap (SO-DIMM), you stick a bare PCB in it (card edge). There's currently no other SoM with this pinout, though. We'll work to change that. 4. Haven't run into issues yet, and opened and closed mine many many times. 5. Simplicity. 6. Type-A is still much more common. The next version could have Type-C or a mix possibly. 7. Totally hackable. The sources are already in our Git / on GitHub but I'll post an article about this during the campaign.
kop316 6y ago
Are you mainlining everything so a vanilla distro can install on this?
- l11r 6y ago
  As far as get it, yes, he does, but currently not everything is at mainline Linux, according to this gist: https://gist.github.com/mntmn/c1005bd9f4cbc53e71058f0a45084da3 https://gist.github.com/mntmn/c1005bd9f4cbc53e71058f0a45084d...
5etho 6y ago
how can We buyers be sure you will deliver the project? What is your experience? what device you previously delivered? there was a lot of kickstarter cool things that deliver poorly
- l11r 6y ago
  He delivered ZZ9000 to many customers: https://mntre.com/media/ZZ9000_info_md/2019-08-09-ZZ9000-resources.html https://mntre.com/media/ZZ9000_info_md/2019-08-09-ZZ9000-res... You can check reports and many photos at his Mastodon: @mntmn@mastodon.social
- detaro 6y ago
  In addition to the specific example l11r mentions: Crowdsupply is generally a lot more trustworthy than Kickstarter. They specialize in hardware products, understand that market and vet projects accordingly. I.e. here prototype devices have been made and distributed to users before the campaign went live.

Main link incl. video: https://www.crowdsupply.com/mnt/reform https://www.crowdsupply.com/mnt/reform Also, AMA!

by mntmn 6y ago

Main link incl. video: https://www.crowdsupply.com/mnt/reform https://www.crowdsupply.com/mnt/reform Also, AMA!

mwcampbell 6y ago

Did you consider using DisplayPort as your, um, display port? Or would that also require a firmware blob?

mntmn 6y ago
Requires the same or similar controller blob (Xtensa) as HDMI on i.MX8M. Edit: To explain, the external DP/HDMI TX shares an IP block and even the signal lines. This is also a reason why we’re using a MIPI DSI->eDP converter chip for the internal display, as that path is blob-free. I wish there was a good blob free USB3 display adapter. Maybe we’ll have to make one.
- fra 6y ago
  Not to sound too negative - I love what you are doing - but using a MIPI DSI -> eDP bridge IC does not get rid of any proprietary blobs. In practice, those bridge ICs contain general purpose MCU cores, and run a proprietary firmware blob. You can usually update it over I2C. So you've just shifted the blob from one part of the stack (AP firmware) to another (bridge IC firmware).
  - mntmn 6y ago
    That is incorrect. There is no updatable firmware blob in the chip that we use: http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/sllseh2b/sllseh2b.pdf?&ts=1588958310547 http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/sllseh2b/sllseh2b.pdf?&ts=158895831...
    - fra 6y ago
      I am very familiar with this IC.

fstephany 6y ago

Following the progress of the Reform project has been fascinating. Thanks a lot for making this and sharing frequent updates :)

armitron 6y ago

I bought your ZZ9000 and I obviously like your work. But I do wish you focused on retro computing. I just can’t see this laptop going anywhere in terms of impact. The field is a black hole that consumes time & effort.

mntmn 6y ago
You’re funny.
- armitron 6y ago
  "I’m funny how, I mean funny like I’m a clown?" In all seriousness, I'd like to support you but I won't, not for this. As somebody else said, in this very thread, it doesn't really stand out and the alternatives are many. Stick to what you do best.
  - mntmn 6y ago
    Don't tell me what to do.
zenexer 6y ago
When you say "retro computing", what do you mean? I assume you have something specific in mind, and I'm curious what that is. I don't think your request is particularly relevant to this HN post, though I may be missing the context since I'd never heard of MNT Research prior to today.

mwcampbell 6y ago

It would be nice to have UnixBench scores in your comparison table. I'm guessing the SoC in the reform won't be in the same league as current Intel laptop processors, but it would be nice to have some idea of what we're getting.

mntmn 6y ago
OK, I’ll look into that. Is that a good benchmark? Are there other meaningful ones?
- mwcampbell 6y ago
  What I like about UnixBench is that it covers I/O as well as raw CPU performance. (So you'd want to make sure it uses the SSD, not the SD card.) And it's open source (edit: actually checked the license now; looks like it's GPL2). I'll let others weigh in with other benchmark suggestions.
  - Cyclenerd 6y ago
    UnixBench would be great. I have a bash script that runs several benchmarks and create a website: https://github.com/Cyclenerd/benchmark https://github.com/Cyclenerd/benchmark You would have to remove Geekbench from Line 650 in the source code. Does not work with ARM.
zenexer 6y ago
I'd also be curious about approximate battery life. Personally, I'd rather a decent ARM SoC and longer battery life than a beefy x86 CPU that's going to drain the battery in two hours.

georgeoliver 6y ago

Have there been any significant changes since your description of the HW here https://mntre.com/media/reform_md/2020-01-18-finishing-reform.html https://mntre.com/media/reform_md/2020-01-18-finishing-refor...? (also, I just love that you incorporated the trackball, thank you).

zenexer 6y ago

1. Roughly how heavy is it? It looks big but not too dense. 2. How easy is it to remap keys on the keyboard and trackball? For example, I'd probably want to swap the Alt and Space keys, the Shift and Up/Del keys, and the Primary/Secondary Click and macro buttons. Are we talking config file change or manually patching firmware? 3. How generic is the SoM connector? Are there any existing alternative SoMs I might be able to stick in there? 4. How many times can I open the body without running into issues? For example, if I swap out the batteries every day for a year, am I going to run into problems? 5. It looks like you opted for a barrel jack instead of USB-PD for charging. Why'd you choose to go that route? 6. Why the lack of USB Type-C ports? 7. "The keyboard not only works as a USB HID device, but it also has a direct UART cable connection to the system controller on the motherboard. By pressing the Circle key, you can interact directly with the system controller, bypassing the main SoC." That sounds really cool. Do you have more info about that? How hackable is it? Edit: I like where you're going with the project, and I think I could easily turn this into my daily driver. Keep up the great work!

danbolt 6y ago
I don't really have MNT's answers to your questions, but I do know that for (7) they have the source for the keyboard firmware on gittea here: https://source.mntmn.com/MNT/reform/src/branch/master/reform2-keyboard-fw https://source.mntmn.com/MNT/reform/src/branch/master/reform...
mntmn 6y ago
Thanks for your questions and encouragement. Answers: 1. ~1.9kg fully loaded with batteries, WiFi card and SSD. 2. Currently you need to rebuild the firmware, which is "make" and then "flash.sh", but it's absolutely feasible to make a nice keymap editor. 3. The connector itself is generic and cheap (SO-DIMM), you stick a bare PCB in it (card edge). There's currently no other SoM with this pinout, though. We'll work to change that. 4. Haven't run into issues yet, and opened and closed mine many many times. 5. Simplicity. 6. Type-A is still much more common. The next version could have Type-C or a mix possibly. 7. Totally hackable. The sources are already in our Git / on GitHub but I'll post an article about this during the campaign.

kop316 6y ago

Are you mainlining everything so a vanilla distro can install on this?

l11r 6y ago
As far as get it, yes, he does, but currently not everything is at mainline Linux, according to this gist: https://gist.github.com/mntmn/c1005bd9f4cbc53e71058f0a45084da3 https://gist.github.com/mntmn/c1005bd9f4cbc53e71058f0a45084d...

5etho 6y ago

how can We buyers be sure you will deliver the project? What is your experience? what device you previously delivered? there was a lot of kickstarter cool things that deliver poorly

l11r 6y ago
He delivered ZZ9000 to many customers: https://mntre.com/media/ZZ9000_info_md/2019-08-09-ZZ9000-resources.html https://mntre.com/media/ZZ9000_info_md/2019-08-09-ZZ9000-res... You can check reports and many photos at his Mastodon: @mntmn@mastodon.social
detaro 6y ago
In addition to the specific example l11r mentions: Crowdsupply is generally a lot more trustworthy than Kickstarter. They specialize in hardware products, understand that market and vet projects accordingly. I.e. here prototype devices have been made and distributed to users before the campaign went live.