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You make good points, but you may be missing why OP's comment is getting the upvotes it's getting, or at least why I'd wager it is: he describes the kind of con

You make good points, but you may be missing why OP's comment is getting the upvotes it's getting, or at least why I'd wager it is: he describes the kind of contentment that most of us can't even imagine possessing without winning the lottery, and he described having that contentment with surprisingly (to him/her) modest means. I can't speak for anyone else, but this is why I upvoted it. Hell, I can think of at least two times in my life where I've been scolded about being unproductive or ambition-less for even mentioning the possibility of living such a life (without being a millionaire). Solely with respect to this person's comment, what we call such an arrangement matters a lot less than the high quality of the life he/she describes.

gustavo-fring 6y ago
He's not giving us the full story. Did he have health insurance (seems like he's in Germany, so yeah)? I made under $30k this past year and did not have health insurance. I promise you that I'd rather have that than try to live off $1k a month. If it sounds so great to you, I challenge you to live off that amount and see if it is as grand as he describes. I'm guessing he's making more than $1k. There are a lot of menial part time jobs you can get if you want to live as he describes. It's not fun.
- ceejayoz 6y ago
  Implementing UBI without universal healthcare certainly would be a silly approach, yes.
  - gustavo-fring 6y ago
    Is the thought process that we can or are going to get both universal healthcare passed (even the Democrats can't agree on this) and UBI passed in this political environment? It's going to take a bigger crisis than covid-19 to do that. It's also not the usual argument you hear from UBI proponents (we can reduce costs because we only need UBI). I don't say this to be a dick, but political change has to happen within political realities.
    - ceejayoz 6y ago
      I share your skepticism that it can get done in the US any time soon. We can't even get people to wear masks during a pandemic. The article in question is about Finland, where healthcare is already universal, largely free, and much liked by the populace.
      - gustavo-fring 6y ago
        That's totally fair. I am looking at this through a very US-centric lens, but I'd guess many HN readers are, and certainly Yang's tech supporters were. To also be fair, the user we are talking about doesn't appear to be Finnish or is the study in question true UBI. But that's all pedantic. :)
  - PeterStuer 6y ago
    That is why I am in favor of universal basic services, but not UBI, and why I called UBI the 'hail mary' of neoliberal market capitalism. UBI wants to change nothing abut the socio-economic structure that drives millions into extreme poverty. It just wants to slightly reduce the rising flood of people that are just run so far down into the ground by the system that they are abandoning society altogether and threaten collapsing it. Make sure all your people have decent healthcare, housing and food. It is obvious that in some (rich) countries these basic levels of social security are failing hard. UBI just wants the current rent-seeking financialization machine to keep churning even when its forced in the extreme to trow the bottom of the pyramid some breadcrumbs to prevent them from bailing out.
- nicbou 6y ago
  I can gladly talk about financials. - I have health insurance. It's pretty far from free, and it's mandatory. I wrote a very detailed guide about how German health insurance works [1]. It's not comparable to the US system, and I want to write a separate guide to explain this more accurately. - My take-home is slightly above what a full time minimum wage worker would make. My expenses are around 1400€ a month. It could be brought down to 1000€, but I insist on certain luxuries and planned my exit accordingly. 1. https://allaboutberlin.com/guides/german-health-insurance https://allaboutberlin.com/guides/german-health-insurance I'm happy to answer more questions.
  - gustavo-fring 6y ago
    Ok. Thank you for the input. Google-fu brings this cite from dw: €1,500 ($1,700) per month gross for full-time workers, Germany has one of the highest minimum wages in the European Union. So it seems you made about $20k. Obviously, this isn't much money, so props to you for that. It is about double what UBI could offer (at least in the US) in a country with one of the greatest social safety nets in the world. Don't mean to castigate you nor be overly personal, but do feel like it is important to put into context.
    - true_religion 6y ago
      I don’t understand all the comparisons to the US here. The article is talking about Finland, and the comment poster is from Germany. Is anyone saying this is appropriate for the US right now? In my opinion, the US has a long way to go before even beginning to consider such practices. The UBI is something EU nations can experiment with, not the US.
      - elliekelly 6y ago
        Can you elaborate? Why can EU countries experiment with UBI but not the US?
        yurishimo 6y ago
EGreg 6y ago
If you want an entire lifestyle blog about this, read http://mrmoneymustache.com/ http://mrmoneymustache.com/ Anyone here a fan?
- themmes 6y ago
  I’m a fan of the Dutch equivalent geldnerd.nl, mrmoneymustache.com is on my list. Thank you!
- voisin 6y ago
  The Mad FIentist is an excellent podcast (FI = Financial Independence), and the reddit forums for LeanFIRE (what OP describes here) and FatFIRE are good. FIRE (Financial Independence, Retire Early). Also, check out the book “Your Money or Your Life”. We don’t need to live the way we do, and I for one commend OP.

gustavo-fring 6y ago

He's not giving us the full story. Did he have health insurance (seems like he's in Germany, so yeah)? I made under $30k this past year and did not have health insurance. I promise you that I'd rather have that than try to live off $1k a month. If it sounds so great to you, I challenge you to live off that amount and see if it is as grand as he describes. I'm guessing he's making more than $1k. There are a lot of menial part time jobs you can get if you want to live as he describes. It's not fun.

ceejayoz 6y ago
Implementing UBI without universal healthcare certainly would be a silly approach, yes.
- gustavo-fring 6y ago
  Is the thought process that we can or are going to get both universal healthcare passed (even the Democrats can't agree on this) and UBI passed in this political environment? It's going to take a bigger crisis than covid-19 to do that. It's also not the usual argument you hear from UBI proponents (we can reduce costs because we only need UBI). I don't say this to be a dick, but political change has to happen within political realities.
  - ceejayoz 6y ago
    I share your skepticism that it can get done in the US any time soon. We can't even get people to wear masks during a pandemic. The article in question is about Finland, where healthcare is already universal, largely free, and much liked by the populace.
    - gustavo-fring 6y ago
      That's totally fair. I am looking at this through a very US-centric lens, but I'd guess many HN readers are, and certainly Yang's tech supporters were. To also be fair, the user we are talking about doesn't appear to be Finnish or is the study in question true UBI. But that's all pedantic. :)
- PeterStuer 6y ago
  That is why I am in favor of universal basic services, but not UBI, and why I called UBI the 'hail mary' of neoliberal market capitalism. UBI wants to change nothing abut the socio-economic structure that drives millions into extreme poverty. It just wants to slightly reduce the rising flood of people that are just run so far down into the ground by the system that they are abandoning society altogether and threaten collapsing it. Make sure all your people have decent healthcare, housing and food. It is obvious that in some (rich) countries these basic levels of social security are failing hard. UBI just wants the current rent-seeking financialization machine to keep churning even when its forced in the extreme to trow the bottom of the pyramid some breadcrumbs to prevent them from bailing out.
nicbou 6y ago
I can gladly talk about financials. - I have health insurance. It's pretty far from free, and it's mandatory. I wrote a very detailed guide about how German health insurance works [1]. It's not comparable to the US system, and I want to write a separate guide to explain this more accurately. - My take-home is slightly above what a full time minimum wage worker would make. My expenses are around 1400€ a month. It could be brought down to 1000€, but I insist on certain luxuries and planned my exit accordingly. 1. https://allaboutberlin.com/guides/german-health-insurance https://allaboutberlin.com/guides/german-health-insurance I'm happy to answer more questions.
- gustavo-fring 6y ago
  Ok. Thank you for the input. Google-fu brings this cite from dw: €1,500 ($1,700) per month gross for full-time workers, Germany has one of the highest minimum wages in the European Union. So it seems you made about $20k. Obviously, this isn't much money, so props to you for that. It is about double what UBI could offer (at least in the US) in a country with one of the greatest social safety nets in the world. Don't mean to castigate you nor be overly personal, but do feel like it is important to put into context.
  - true_religion 6y ago
    I don’t understand all the comparisons to the US here. The article is talking about Finland, and the comment poster is from Germany. Is anyone saying this is appropriate for the US right now? In my opinion, the US has a long way to go before even beginning to consider such practices. The UBI is something EU nations can experiment with, not the US.
    - elliekelly 6y ago
      Can you elaborate? Why can EU countries experiment with UBI but not the US?
      - yurishimo 6y ago

EGreg 6y ago

If you want an entire lifestyle blog about this, read http://mrmoneymustache.com/ http://mrmoneymustache.com/ Anyone here a fan?

themmes 6y ago
I’m a fan of the Dutch equivalent geldnerd.nl, mrmoneymustache.com is on my list. Thank you!
voisin 6y ago
The Mad FIentist is an excellent podcast (FI = Financial Independence), and the reddit forums for LeanFIRE (what OP describes here) and FatFIRE are good. FIRE (Financial Independence, Retire Early). Also, check out the book “Your Money or Your Life”. We don’t need to live the way we do, and I for one commend OP.