3 ms·

Sure, we cant shutdown forever, but I dont understand the rush to sacrifice. Covid will be with us forever now, and in just a few months we already understand

Sure, we cant shutdown forever, but I dont understand the rush to sacrifice. Covid will be with us forever now, and in just a few months we already understand a lot more about it than we did at the start. The longer we can delay mass infection, the more effective our treatment of the disease will be, and the more likely we will have vaccines. Lets delay for a while, figure out the best treatment methods, and then let it through.

throwawayrcheck 6y ago
2 months is too early. Can you name a date when we should open? Can you even name a date that is obviously too late? I've struggled with the same questions. I noticed that no matter which date I picked, 'let's delay longer' was always the preferred choice. We've got to wean ourselves from the lockdown.
- bandushrew 6y ago
  We're in NZ, its feeling likely at the moment that the date will be wednesday. OTOH we have been incredibly lucky with both our leadership and our island status. the US is a huge state, with porous borders so the right choice might be different, but the more controlled the spread is, the fewer lives will be lost and the more likely time will help us understand the best treatment.
mikem170 6y ago
>The longer we can delay mass infection, the more effective our treatment of the disease will be You can stay in your house until the treatments get better, which is also a smart thing for vulnerable people to do. Why not let other people off lockdown if they wish as long as the hospitals are not overflowed? A lot of people face a negligable risk from this. What difference would it be to you? And look at the cost to them, tens of millions of people's livelihoods thrown up in the air. Having said the above, I do see the value of lockdowns that prevented hospitals from being overwhelmed. That is different. But it looks to me like we can look at moving past that threat. What do we do next?
- bandushrew 6y ago
  Its not about me. The benefit comes when the community as a whole does it, there is literally no point to anyone doing it alone, unless they are vulnerable. "What do we do next?" Figure out the best way to treat covid, and talk about the best time to end the lockdown. Im in NZ btw, NZ locked down hard and early. Its been six weeks and so far we have 20 deaths from covid. "What next?" is exactly the question, and I dont think anyone knows the best answer yet. We are likely to be mostly ending our lockdown on this wednesday. We are entering "level 2" which I believe is all businesses open and running, just some rules around congregation. I simply do not understand the chorus of calls to end lockdown (or simply never start it) in countries where absolutely nothing is under control. It will cause incredibly loss of life, and people are doing in a rush. Im really struggling, on a personal level, to understand the rush in some countries to sacrifice people and not economies. Surely the economy is there to serve us?
  - mikem170 6y ago
    NZ did a great job of jumping on this early. Last week when I looked they something like 1000-2000 confirmed cases? NZ has been able to effectively eradicate the disease there with their early lockdown. It will be interesting to see how things go there over time (second wave? etc) That is quite a different scenario than in the U.S., where there were hundreds of thousands of infections (millions?), not enough tests to go after eradication at this point, etc. Were you thinking that the U.S. would be able to maintain a lockdown until eradication, perhaps with contact tracing? Is there evidence that such a plan could work? I understand your struggle to see my point of view. Ditto! I read a book that posited that people are born with personality differences, and value some things more than others. For example, I feel very strongly about individualism and anti-authority, while others may be more communitarian and authoritarian. The world ultimately benefits from both. Having said that, I wonder what practical benefits a person who chooses to self-isolate in any of a number of countries where this is endemic gains by forcing other to lockdown against their will when the hospitals are not overflowing. Why should the many young and healthy who face a negligible risk to continue in what is sometimes very difficult circumstances? What is really gained at this point? Anyways, that was all meant to be a peek into my thinking.

throwawayrcheck 6y ago

2 months is too early. Can you name a date when we should open? Can you even name a date that is obviously too late? I've struggled with the same questions. I noticed that no matter which date I picked, 'let's delay longer' was always the preferred choice. We've got to wean ourselves from the lockdown.

bandushrew 6y ago
We're in NZ, its feeling likely at the moment that the date will be wednesday. OTOH we have been incredibly lucky with both our leadership and our island status. the US is a huge state, with porous borders so the right choice might be different, but the more controlled the spread is, the fewer lives will be lost and the more likely time will help us understand the best treatment.

mikem170 6y ago

>The longer we can delay mass infection, the more effective our treatment of the disease will be You can stay in your house until the treatments get better, which is also a smart thing for vulnerable people to do. Why not let other people off lockdown if they wish as long as the hospitals are not overflowed? A lot of people face a negligable risk from this. What difference would it be to you? And look at the cost to them, tens of millions of people's livelihoods thrown up in the air. Having said the above, I do see the value of lockdowns that prevented hospitals from being overwhelmed. That is different. But it looks to me like we can look at moving past that threat. What do we do next?

bandushrew 6y ago
Its not about me. The benefit comes when the community as a whole does it, there is literally no point to anyone doing it alone, unless they are vulnerable. "What do we do next?" Figure out the best way to treat covid, and talk about the best time to end the lockdown. Im in NZ btw, NZ locked down hard and early. Its been six weeks and so far we have 20 deaths from covid. "What next?" is exactly the question, and I dont think anyone knows the best answer yet. We are likely to be mostly ending our lockdown on this wednesday. We are entering "level 2" which I believe is all businesses open and running, just some rules around congregation. I simply do not understand the chorus of calls to end lockdown (or simply never start it) in countries where absolutely nothing is under control. It will cause incredibly loss of life, and people are doing in a rush. Im really struggling, on a personal level, to understand the rush in some countries to sacrifice people and not economies. Surely the economy is there to serve us?
- mikem170 6y ago
  NZ did a great job of jumping on this early. Last week when I looked they something like 1000-2000 confirmed cases? NZ has been able to effectively eradicate the disease there with their early lockdown. It will be interesting to see how things go there over time (second wave? etc) That is quite a different scenario than in the U.S., where there were hundreds of thousands of infections (millions?), not enough tests to go after eradication at this point, etc. Were you thinking that the U.S. would be able to maintain a lockdown until eradication, perhaps with contact tracing? Is there evidence that such a plan could work? I understand your struggle to see my point of view. Ditto! I read a book that posited that people are born with personality differences, and value some things more than others. For example, I feel very strongly about individualism and anti-authority, while others may be more communitarian and authoritarian. The world ultimately benefits from both. Having said that, I wonder what practical benefits a person who chooses to self-isolate in any of a number of countries where this is endemic gains by forcing other to lockdown against their will when the hospitals are not overflowing. Why should the many young and healthy who face a negligible risk to continue in what is sometimes very difficult circumstances? What is really gained at this point? Anyways, that was all meant to be a peek into my thinking.