7 ms·

Ask HN: Which smartphone to buy as a tool, not a toy

8 points by lqet 6y ago

I am searching for a new smartphone which I can use to read and write mails, check my calendar, look at maps, SSH into remote machines, take notes, make good pictures, check public transit schedules and occasionally as a telephone. I want a device with a high build quality, no too big and which will last at least 5 years. My current device since 2010 is a Samsung Galaxy S i9000. When I watch reviews on YouTube or read comments on Amazon, the main points discussed there are very often things like "the battery is drained after watching 3 hours of Netflix" or "the display resolution is so 2014 / the display is too small" or "the front camera does not take good selfies", etc. I do not care about such things. I currently have the Blackberry Key2 in mind, but I am put off a bit by the price. Basically, what I am looking for is a smartphone variant of a classic Thinkpad.

virvar 6y ago
I’d probably pick the new iPhone SE. Unless you have something personal against using Apple products it seems like the perfect fit for what you want at a decent price point.
- deeblering4 6y ago
  Came here to say this. Solid hardware running IOS with a good quality camera at $399 is a price/performance sweet spot IMO.
lukaszkups 6y ago
OMG this is soo my topic right now - I'm also thinking hard about Key2 - especially Silver color which is really difficult to find (brand new). I'm a huge fan of QWERTY keyboards in mobile phones, I really miss out the times when there was a broad choice.. But now, you're basically have BB Key2, BB Key2 LE or F(x) - all of them are pricey as hell for what they offer, unfortunately. I started consider do buy some older phone for daily driver, and keep the current one for photos/social media/GPS without the sim card even, so as a toy, but I'm still not sure - will happily listen what other HNers have to say here. The other option might be to wait for Surface Duo till the end of the year, but I think it will be way more pricy than Blackberries..
- easytiger 6y ago
  I had/have a key one. Real pity they just didn't pull it off. I'd could have come close to being perfect. Some minor tweaks to the android UI made it very usable. Unfortunately it was pretty slow (on the upside had incredible battery life)
  - lukaszkups 6y ago
    yeah I've heard about its issues (I've always dig around for a very long time before buying new phone), but it seems that they've fixed it since Key1 Black edition and later ones right? And yeah, I also consider Key1 BlackEdition - pity that they haven't released it in Silver color haha :)
    - easytiger 6y ago
      Yea i had a keyone silver but returned it within 2 days because the screen literally fell out! Replaced with a black edition. Used as phone for a while. Perfectly usable, but just felt very slow. If it had been a bit faster, and a bit larger, it would have been nearly perfect. loved the keyboard and high res screen. Poor camera alas due to no software tweaks. I'm glad others are pin\ing for this kind of device. Really miss them.
  - lqet 6y ago
    How was your experience with the keyboard? Is it usable?
    - easytiger 6y ago
      Very usable. Felt very well made as well to be honest and i felt that typing longer notes/emails was much less tedious than on a soft keyboard. Personally, despite a soft keyboard with swype etc being faster, i get a mental fatigue doing anything long that needed lots of editing which i didn't on the Keyone black. Very clever feature is you could swipe on the keyboard to move the cursor as well. Also you can set up keyboard shortcuts to press/long press to open an app/perform action when on home screen. Hub software excellent also.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
rogierhofboer 6y ago
If you say phone as a tool https://www.catphones.com/en-gb/cat-s52-rugged-4g-smartphone/ https://www.catphones.com/en-gb/cat-s52-rugged-4g-smartphone... pops up in my mind...
- RandomBacon 6y ago
  Unless they've changed course, a couple of years ago when I was looking into their phones, quality was hit-or-miss and they barely get any Android updates.
pryelluw 6y ago
I have a samsung note8 with termux. Some months ago I bought a small portable keyboars that connects to the phone through usb-c. Works very well. Can and do code on the phone.
olcor 6y ago
An Apple phone is a good bet. They last quite long, have a fantastic battery life (especially for your use cases), do everything you're asking for (including having SSH clients / terminal emulators) and some of them aren't too big. For the most part you can definitely find what you want with an older-gen iphone, or the new SE. Unfortunately mobile systems have now consolidated to only iOS and Android, and many android phones don't get regular updates / get much slower within 1 year / aren't supported long and even not expected to have a long life by their manufacturers. OTOH lots of people hold on to their iphones for a really long time because they just work, and for many years. Notice how many people still hold the original SE or the 7.
- deeblering4 6y ago
  Speaking of iOS terminals, check out iSH. It provides a virtualized linux instance that runs on your phone and a nice terminal emulator. It’s been a big workflow improvement over an iOS ssh client only terminal for me.
sheepybloke 6y ago
You might want to look into some of the Motorola line (Maybe like the Motorola power if you want a real tool) or like the Pixel 3a. Affordable, with a great camera on the Pixel and OK on the Motorola's, and just solid phones. Not too many bells and whistles, but does the job well.
dangus 6y ago
The new iPhone SE at $399. Or, Apple sells the XR at $499, which I think for some folks could be a better deal. It gets you a more modern form factor, should have a better camera, and will definitely have better battery life than the SE under heavy load. Also, in my opinion, the gesture-based system found on iPhone X-style iPhones is greatly superior to home button equipped iPhones. The XR (or the 11) is on the larger side, though. The best thing that Apple sells that’s as small as possible is the iPhone 11 Pro. You could pick up an Xs or X instead to save money - but the 11 Pro has much better battery life than those. Still, all options will get you to the end of the day with light usage. Don’t forget to buy any storage upgrade you need up front. Don’t forget to check Apple’s own refurbished store, which sells devices that are essentially new with the same warranty at a discount. I don’t even think Android is a decent consideration for what you want unless you specifically shop for something that works well with custom ROMs. Android software support is just too short. And it really sounds like you want a phone that doesn’t eat up your time with tinkering and tweaking, Apple fits that bill. And you want to take pictures - with Apple you basically just can’t go wrong with the cameras. They’re always simple and fast, with unopinionated results. For small-ish phones, probably the only decent Android choices are the Sony Xperia Compact line or the smallest Google Pixel phones. Almost everything Android is huge. I believe this is due to their poor battery optimization where every device needs a 4,000 Mah battery just to get through the day. The Pixel 3A could work for you but it isn’t sold with more than 64GB of storage and it’s a lot slower than the new iPhone SE. Apple will get you at least 5 years of software updates (which is on an increasing trend) with their phones since their release date. They have a high resale value and migrating from one to another is a breeze. Even when you lose software updates, the App Store and most apps continue to work for a long time. Apple even recently patched FaceTime so that it wouldn’t break iOS 9 compatibility (which is 4 versions ago). In contrast, the original Pixel just lost software updates, while its Apple contemporaries remain supported. While the idea of owning a long-lasting phone like a ThinkPad is appealing, I don’t really think it ends up making a lot of practical sense just given the fact that phones aren’t really sold that way. I think that, on an economic level, the best way to have a reliable supported phone at all times might be to simply buy Apple’s 2 year old phone every year, and then sell it the next year in favor whatever the next 2 year old phone is. If you do it that way you essentially avoid the frontal depreciation and you’re probably spending $100 a year or less on a phone after you sell the old one, and never losing software support or running with a busted up phone.
2rsf 6y ago
I would go the exact opposite of the iPhone way, a few people I know have been using different generations of Xiaomi Redmi's as tool phones with great satisfaction. Surprisingly the build quality is good and battery life is amazing. You can have dual SIM or a SIM and extra memory card. It is not a great phone for gaming or photography, but that's not what you are looking for. Now assuming the batteries decay over time, screens break and phones fall into the toilet or getting stolen you can buy 2 Redmi's for the price of one iPhone SE.
entha_saava 6y ago
Buy an Android which has OEM unlock and well supported by LineageOS. Don't listen to apple fanboys here. On Android you can have a full blown Linux Terminal, because Android is Linux underneath. Termux works without rooting. You can set up a Debian CLI environment using proot on termux and let it run on startup by editing startup file. There are tutorials to run X / Wayland without rooting too. Admittedly I haven't found a need for that so far but that's possible. Or instead of using Debian environment, you can use vanilla termux environment and have access to Android API if you want. Even then you can still have a Debian / Ubuntu CLI environment On iOS you can't install different browsers either. On Android you can install Firefox for Android and it supports uBlock Origin. You can change KeyBoard app and there are many options to choose from. Device automation is pretty good too.. There are OSS apps on F-Droid and some are quite good. Having OEM unlock Lineage OS support means after OEM discontionues support you can unlock bootloader and install LineageOS. Or if you are feeling adventurous, I suggest to check about pinephone which runs linux, although I don't know much about pinephone - just heard about it once on linux subreddit.
- g1991 6y ago
  "On iOS you can't install different browsers either." ???
  - entha_saava 6y ago
    The engine is restricted to be WebKit..

8 points by lqet 6y ago

virvar 6y ago

I’d probably pick the new iPhone SE. Unless you have something personal against using Apple products it seems like the perfect fit for what you want at a decent price point.

deeblering4 6y ago
Came here to say this. Solid hardware running IOS with a good quality camera at $399 is a price/performance sweet spot IMO.

lukaszkups 6y ago

OMG this is soo my topic right now - I'm also thinking hard about Key2 - especially Silver color which is really difficult to find (brand new). I'm a huge fan of QWERTY keyboards in mobile phones, I really miss out the times when there was a broad choice.. But now, you're basically have BB Key2, BB Key2 LE or F(x) - all of them are pricey as hell for what they offer, unfortunately. I started consider do buy some older phone for daily driver, and keep the current one for photos/social media/GPS without the sim card even, so as a toy, but I'm still not sure - will happily listen what other HNers have to say here. The other option might be to wait for Surface Duo till the end of the year, but I think it will be way more pricy than Blackberries..

easytiger 6y ago
I had/have a key one. Real pity they just didn't pull it off. I'd could have come close to being perfect. Some minor tweaks to the android UI made it very usable. Unfortunately it was pretty slow (on the upside had incredible battery life)
- lukaszkups 6y ago
  yeah I've heard about its issues (I've always dig around for a very long time before buying new phone), but it seems that they've fixed it since Key1 Black edition and later ones right? And yeah, I also consider Key1 BlackEdition - pity that they haven't released it in Silver color haha :)
  - easytiger 6y ago
    Yea i had a keyone silver but returned it within 2 days because the screen literally fell out! Replaced with a black edition. Used as phone for a while. Perfectly usable, but just felt very slow. If it had been a bit faster, and a bit larger, it would have been nearly perfect. loved the keyboard and high res screen. Poor camera alas due to no software tweaks. I'm glad others are pin\ing for this kind of device. Really miss them.
- lqet 6y ago
  How was your experience with the keyboard? Is it usable?
  - easytiger 6y ago
    Very usable. Felt very well made as well to be honest and i felt that typing longer notes/emails was much less tedious than on a soft keyboard. Personally, despite a soft keyboard with swype etc being faster, i get a mental fatigue doing anything long that needed lots of editing which i didn't on the Keyone black. Very clever feature is you could swipe on the keyboard to move the cursor as well. Also you can set up keyboard shortcuts to press/long press to open an app/perform action when on home screen. Hub software excellent also.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

rogierhofboer 6y ago

If you say phone as a tool https://www.catphones.com/en-gb/cat-s52-rugged-4g-smartphone/ https://www.catphones.com/en-gb/cat-s52-rugged-4g-smartphone... pops up in my mind...

RandomBacon 6y ago
Unless they've changed course, a couple of years ago when I was looking into their phones, quality was hit-or-miss and they barely get any Android updates.

pryelluw 6y ago

I have a samsung note8 with termux. Some months ago I bought a small portable keyboars that connects to the phone through usb-c. Works very well. Can and do code on the phone.

olcor 6y ago

An Apple phone is a good bet. They last quite long, have a fantastic battery life (especially for your use cases), do everything you're asking for (including having SSH clients / terminal emulators) and some of them aren't too big. For the most part you can definitely find what you want with an older-gen iphone, or the new SE. Unfortunately mobile systems have now consolidated to only iOS and Android, and many android phones don't get regular updates / get much slower within 1 year / aren't supported long and even not expected to have a long life by their manufacturers. OTOH lots of people hold on to their iphones for a really long time because they just work, and for many years. Notice how many people still hold the original SE or the 7.

deeblering4 6y ago
Speaking of iOS terminals, check out iSH. It provides a virtualized linux instance that runs on your phone and a nice terminal emulator. It’s been a big workflow improvement over an iOS ssh client only terminal for me.

sheepybloke 6y ago

You might want to look into some of the Motorola line (Maybe like the Motorola power if you want a real tool) or like the Pixel 3a. Affordable, with a great camera on the Pixel and OK on the Motorola's, and just solid phones. Not too many bells and whistles, but does the job well.

dangus 6y ago

The new iPhone SE at $399. Or, Apple sells the XR at $499, which I think for some folks could be a better deal. It gets you a more modern form factor, should have a better camera, and will definitely have better battery life than the SE under heavy load. Also, in my opinion, the gesture-based system found on iPhone X-style iPhones is greatly superior to home button equipped iPhones. The XR (or the 11) is on the larger side, though. The best thing that Apple sells that’s as small as possible is the iPhone 11 Pro. You could pick up an Xs or X instead to save money - but the 11 Pro has much better battery life than those. Still, all options will get you to the end of the day with light usage. Don’t forget to buy any storage upgrade you need up front. Don’t forget to check Apple’s own refurbished store, which sells devices that are essentially new with the same warranty at a discount. I don’t even think Android is a decent consideration for what you want unless you specifically shop for something that works well with custom ROMs. Android software support is just too short. And it really sounds like you want a phone that doesn’t eat up your time with tinkering and tweaking, Apple fits that bill. And you want to take pictures - with Apple you basically just can’t go wrong with the cameras. They’re always simple and fast, with unopinionated results. For small-ish phones, probably the only decent Android choices are the Sony Xperia Compact line or the smallest Google Pixel phones. Almost everything Android is huge. I believe this is due to their poor battery optimization where every device needs a 4,000 Mah battery just to get through the day. The Pixel 3A could work for you but it isn’t sold with more than 64GB of storage and it’s a lot slower than the new iPhone SE. Apple will get you at least 5 years of software updates (which is on an increasing trend) with their phones since their release date. They have a high resale value and migrating from one to another is a breeze. Even when you lose software updates, the App Store and most apps continue to work for a long time. Apple even recently patched FaceTime so that it wouldn’t break iOS 9 compatibility (which is 4 versions ago). In contrast, the original Pixel just lost software updates, while its Apple contemporaries remain supported. While the idea of owning a long-lasting phone like a ThinkPad is appealing, I don’t really think it ends up making a lot of practical sense just given the fact that phones aren’t really sold that way. I think that, on an economic level, the best way to have a reliable supported phone at all times might be to simply buy Apple’s 2 year old phone every year, and then sell it the next year in favor whatever the next 2 year old phone is. If you do it that way you essentially avoid the frontal depreciation and you’re probably spending $100 a year or less on a phone after you sell the old one, and never losing software support or running with a busted up phone.

2rsf 6y ago

I would go the exact opposite of the iPhone way, a few people I know have been using different generations of Xiaomi Redmi's as tool phones with great satisfaction. Surprisingly the build quality is good and battery life is amazing. You can have dual SIM or a SIM and extra memory card. It is not a great phone for gaming or photography, but that's not what you are looking for. Now assuming the batteries decay over time, screens break and phones fall into the toilet or getting stolen you can buy 2 Redmi's for the price of one iPhone SE.

entha_saava 6y ago

Buy an Android which has OEM unlock and well supported by LineageOS. Don't listen to apple fanboys here. On Android you can have a full blown Linux Terminal, because Android is Linux underneath. Termux works without rooting. You can set up a Debian CLI environment using proot on termux and let it run on startup by editing startup file. There are tutorials to run X / Wayland without rooting too. Admittedly I haven't found a need for that so far but that's possible. Or instead of using Debian environment, you can use vanilla termux environment and have access to Android API if you want. Even then you can still have a Debian / Ubuntu CLI environment On iOS you can't install different browsers either. On Android you can install Firefox for Android and it supports uBlock Origin. You can change KeyBoard app and there are many options to choose from. Device automation is pretty good too.. There are OSS apps on F-Droid and some are quite good. Having OEM unlock Lineage OS support means after OEM discontionues support you can unlock bootloader and install LineageOS. Or if you are feeling adventurous, I suggest to check about pinephone which runs linux, although I don't know much about pinephone - just heard about it once on linux subreddit.

g1991 6y ago
"On iOS you can't install different browsers either." ???
- entha_saava 6y ago
  The engine is restricted to be WebKit..