6 ms·

Yup all the free stuff is ultimately to lead us into using and paying for Azure. Need an open source alternative to GitHub.

by suyash 6y ago

dkarlovi 6y ago
GitLab has been great for a while and actually had some features before GH.
- sytse 6y ago
  Thanks for the mention. As for how the features today map: 1. GitHub Insights => GitLab Insights https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/project/insights/ https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/project/insights/ Code Review Analytics https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/analytics/code_review_analytics.html https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/analytics/code_review_analyt... DevOps Score https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/instance_statistics/dev_ops_score.html https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/instance_statistics/dev_ops_... and Value Stream analytics https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/analytics/value_stream_analytics.html https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/analytics/value_stream_analy... 2. GitHub CodeScanning => GitLab SAST https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/application_security/sast/ https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/application_security/sast/ and Secret Detection https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/application_security/sast/#secret-detection https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/application_security/sast/#s... 3. GitHub Codespaces => GitLab Live Preview with client side evaluation https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/project/web_ide/index.html#client-side-evaluation https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/project/web_ide/index.html#c... and upcoming server side evaluation https://gitlab.com/groups/gitlab-org/-/epics/167 https://gitlab.com/groups/gitlab-org/-/epics/167 which would work both with on-premises Kubernetes clusters and in any cloud.
  - misterhtmlcss 6y ago
    Simple but big issue I have is getting solutions that suit the platform. Often when I'm looking for help on something it gives me the on-prem solution. Docs on your website are confusing for this reason and that's why I stopped using. Takes me 30 seconds to solve a problem on GH and 5min to solve the same problem on GL. Clean that up so when devs try out the platform it's slick and easy to buy into not annoying and difficult.
mbreese 6y ago
Sourcehut would like to have a word... https://sr.ht/ https://sr.ht/
- brightball 6y ago
  I had not seen that...interesting.
  - SkyMarshal 6y ago
    Source hut is cool. Among things, it prioritizes exposing and leveraging Git's existing functionality wherever possible, like email patches, rather than building new proprietary functionality on top of Git like Github and others do.
    - AgentME 6y ago
      Everything about Github's PR workflow is killer to me, so to me personally the message I take away from this is that Source Hut isn't even competing with Github in the parts I care about.
      - SkyMarshal 6y ago
        If the one particular aspect I mentioned isn't for you then why even bother wasting your valuable time responding? Just go read their website instead and see if there is something for you. Maybe there is, maybe there isn't, but at least then you'd know definitively. Much better use of your time and effort. I'll even save you a few clicks: https://drewdevault.com/2018/11/15/sr.ht-general-availability.html https://drewdevault.com/2018/11/15/sr.ht-general-availabilit... https://sourcehut.org/ https://sourcehut.org/
        AgentME 6y ago
        I posted because I think my post would be useful to other people who are considering alternatives to GitHub but also like rich PR workflows like GitHub has, and because I think it's good to encourage would-be GitHub alternatives to invest in that area. I've actually been following Sourcehut's mailing list and updates since forever because I find their philosophies interesting, but not right or practical for my own workflow.
KukicAdnan 6y ago
Why is that a bad thing? If you found value in Azure and it solved your problem, why is that a negative?
- yarrel 6y ago
  The trap is comfy and warm. Why ask what the springs are connected to?
- SamBam 6y ago
  Switching costs. If the things are offered free, and you build a lot of it into your system, and now it costs money, you have to choose between paying that money, or paying a potentially high switching cost to move to a different system. If you had known you were going to be faced with those costs, you may never have bought into the system in the first place.
Kipters 6y ago
Why? It's not like you MUST deploy on Azure
- donmcronald 6y ago
  I think it's more about all of the integration leading to efficiencies that are hard to ignore while they're being subsidized / promoted. It'll start out as something where the value proposition is too good to ignore, but, as time goes on, they'll tier off features and charge a premium as you scale up. There was a time when I was hopeful and though Microsoft would take a developer first approach with the end goal being making it easy to deploy to Azure. After seeing the VSO (the old name for Codespaces) pricing I'm a lot more cynical. Microsoft's going to be altruistic until they're not. Go look at the pricing for VSO. They have a full time dev (100 hours a month - lol) estimated at a cost of $23 USD per month. Just wait until there's some type of marketplace for extension developers. The local version of VSCode will disappear overnight and (IMO) we'll be paying $50+ / month for the same thing that's free right now. Get ready to pay for everything per user per month for the rest of your life.
  - nicoburns 6y ago
    > The local version of VSCode will disappear overnight That's the beauty of open source though. VSCode is prominent enough that someone will fork it and maintain it if Microsoft pulls the plug.
    - donmcronald 6y ago
      My fear is that an officially supported marketplace for selling extensions would be appealing enough that important extensions would put all future development effort into their marketplace versions and cease development of local versions.
  - nikmd23 6y ago
    Hi! PM on the Codespaces team here. I wanted to quickly help calm any potential concerns about changes to VS Code or its model. Codespaces is a separate, additional service from VS Code, very much focused on providing compute catered to developers and their workflows. We hope you'll use and love it, but we're also very happy if you'd prefer to continue to use VS Code in the ways that you may have previously done. Either way, we will continue to invest heavily in VS Code as you know it. Codespaces will not change that. Hopefully that helps clarify any concerns!
evilduck 6y ago
Gitlab CE, Gitea, Gogs
- jannes 6y ago
  Some background on these: Gitea is a fork of Gogs. Both are written in Go and are pretty light on resources (they support SQLite as database backend). Gitlab is heavier on resources and requires at least Postgresql and Redis.
  - ckok 6y ago
    Gitlab looks nicer and has a lot more features even in the open source edition. (Though some paid features seem to be arbitrary paid vs free, like scoped tags, a feature everyone could use is paid, while a really Enterprise feature like kubernetes support is free)
aprdm 6y ago
Doesn't gitlab fit the bill here?

Yup all the free stuff is ultimately to lead us into using and paying for Azure. Need an open source alternative to GitHub.

by suyash 6y ago

Yup all the free stuff is ultimately to lead us into using and paying for Azure. Need an open source alternative to GitHub.

dkarlovi 6y ago

GitLab has been great for a while and actually had some features before GH.

sytse 6y ago
Thanks for the mention. As for how the features today map: 1. GitHub Insights => GitLab Insights https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/project/insights/ https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/project/insights/ Code Review Analytics https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/analytics/code_review_analytics.html https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/analytics/code_review_analyt... DevOps Score https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/instance_statistics/dev_ops_score.html https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/instance_statistics/dev_ops_... and Value Stream analytics https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/analytics/value_stream_analytics.html https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/analytics/value_stream_analy... 2. GitHub CodeScanning => GitLab SAST https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/application_security/sast/ https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/application_security/sast/ and Secret Detection https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/application_security/sast/#secret-detection https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/application_security/sast/#s... 3. GitHub Codespaces => GitLab Live Preview with client side evaluation https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/project/web_ide/index.html#client-side-evaluation https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/user/project/web_ide/index.html#c... and upcoming server side evaluation https://gitlab.com/groups/gitlab-org/-/epics/167 https://gitlab.com/groups/gitlab-org/-/epics/167 which would work both with on-premises Kubernetes clusters and in any cloud.
- misterhtmlcss 6y ago
  Simple but big issue I have is getting solutions that suit the platform. Often when I'm looking for help on something it gives me the on-prem solution. Docs on your website are confusing for this reason and that's why I stopped using. Takes me 30 seconds to solve a problem on GH and 5min to solve the same problem on GL. Clean that up so when devs try out the platform it's slick and easy to buy into not annoying and difficult.

mbreese 6y ago

Sourcehut would like to have a word... https://sr.ht/ https://sr.ht/

brightball 6y ago
I had not seen that...interesting.
- SkyMarshal 6y ago
  Source hut is cool. Among things, it prioritizes exposing and leveraging Git's existing functionality wherever possible, like email patches, rather than building new proprietary functionality on top of Git like Github and others do.
  - AgentME 6y ago
    Everything about Github's PR workflow is killer to me, so to me personally the message I take away from this is that Source Hut isn't even competing with Github in the parts I care about.
    - SkyMarshal 6y ago
      If the one particular aspect I mentioned isn't for you then why even bother wasting your valuable time responding? Just go read their website instead and see if there is something for you. Maybe there is, maybe there isn't, but at least then you'd know definitively. Much better use of your time and effort. I'll even save you a few clicks: https://drewdevault.com/2018/11/15/sr.ht-general-availability.html https://drewdevault.com/2018/11/15/sr.ht-general-availabilit... https://sourcehut.org/ https://sourcehut.org/
      - AgentME 6y ago
        I posted because I think my post would be useful to other people who are considering alternatives to GitHub but also like rich PR workflows like GitHub has, and because I think it's good to encourage would-be GitHub alternatives to invest in that area. I've actually been following Sourcehut's mailing list and updates since forever because I find their philosophies interesting, but not right or practical for my own workflow.

KukicAdnan 6y ago

Why is that a bad thing? If you found value in Azure and it solved your problem, why is that a negative?

yarrel 6y ago
The trap is comfy and warm. Why ask what the springs are connected to?
SamBam 6y ago
Switching costs. If the things are offered free, and you build a lot of it into your system, and now it costs money, you have to choose between paying that money, or paying a potentially high switching cost to move to a different system. If you had known you were going to be faced with those costs, you may never have bought into the system in the first place.

Kipters 6y ago

Why? It's not like you MUST deploy on Azure

donmcronald 6y ago
I think it's more about all of the integration leading to efficiencies that are hard to ignore while they're being subsidized / promoted. It'll start out as something where the value proposition is too good to ignore, but, as time goes on, they'll tier off features and charge a premium as you scale up. There was a time when I was hopeful and though Microsoft would take a developer first approach with the end goal being making it easy to deploy to Azure. After seeing the VSO (the old name for Codespaces) pricing I'm a lot more cynical. Microsoft's going to be altruistic until they're not. Go look at the pricing for VSO. They have a full time dev (100 hours a month - lol) estimated at a cost of $23 USD per month. Just wait until there's some type of marketplace for extension developers. The local version of VSCode will disappear overnight and (IMO) we'll be paying $50+ / month for the same thing that's free right now. Get ready to pay for everything per user per month for the rest of your life.
- nicoburns 6y ago
  > The local version of VSCode will disappear overnight That's the beauty of open source though. VSCode is prominent enough that someone will fork it and maintain it if Microsoft pulls the plug.
  - donmcronald 6y ago
    My fear is that an officially supported marketplace for selling extensions would be appealing enough that important extensions would put all future development effort into their marketplace versions and cease development of local versions.
- nikmd23 6y ago
  Hi! PM on the Codespaces team here. I wanted to quickly help calm any potential concerns about changes to VS Code or its model. Codespaces is a separate, additional service from VS Code, very much focused on providing compute catered to developers and their workflows. We hope you'll use and love it, but we're also very happy if you'd prefer to continue to use VS Code in the ways that you may have previously done. Either way, we will continue to invest heavily in VS Code as you know it. Codespaces will not change that. Hopefully that helps clarify any concerns!

evilduck 6y ago

Gitlab CE, Gitea, Gogs

jannes 6y ago
Some background on these: Gitea is a fork of Gogs. Both are written in Go and are pretty light on resources (they support SQLite as database backend). Gitlab is heavier on resources and requires at least Postgresql and Redis.
- ckok 6y ago
  Gitlab looks nicer and has a lot more features even in the open source edition. (Though some paid features seem to be arbitrary paid vs free, like scoped tags, a feature everyone could use is paid, while a really Enterprise feature like kubernetes support is free)

aprdm 6y ago

Doesn't gitlab fit the bill here?