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> it's obviously a stark improvement I really wish people would say what they mean when they make comments like this. It's extremely vague and some of the obvi

> it's obviously a stark improvement I really wish people would say what they mean when they make comments like this. It's extremely vague and some of the obvious meanings are either subjective or can be easily shot down: * It has more / better features? No, it seems to have fewer features, at least if add-on support is a good indication. * The GUI is better? Subjective at best, I find it worse. * Web pages load faster / JS execution is faster? This is also subjective unless objective measurements are used, but this is what people most often mean. I've attempted to measure the objective speed of the browser myself. I've consistently found: Javascript performance is not significantly improved by the new browser. As measured by Speedometer [1], the new Firefox is less than 10% faster than the old one, and both are barely half as fast as Chrome on the same device. The performance of the GUI is also lacking: it takes so much more time to open menus and use GUI features that the difference is actually clearly visible to the eye. [2] Basically, I think it's very easy to be deceived by placebo effects when what we're talking about is the apparent performance of a browser. The objective metrics I've been able to capture often show the new FFA to be as slow or slower than the previous version, and when it's faster, it's not by much, at least (in my opinion) not close enough to catching up to Chrome to justify a complete browser rewrite, with everything that has entailed. [1] https://browserbench.org/Speedometer2.0/ https://browserbench.org/Speedometer2.0/ [2] See: multiple open issues for animation jank. I found these with a quick search. https://github.com/mozilla-mobile/fenix/issues/10065 https://github.com/mozilla-mobile/fenix/issues/10065 https://github.com/mozilla-mobile/fenix/issues/7797 https://github.com/mozilla-mobile/fenix/issues/7797 https://github.com/mozilla-mobile/fenix/issues/8863 https://github.com/mozilla-mobile/fenix/issues/8863 https://github.com/mozilla-mobile/fenix/issues/9746 https://github.com/mozilla-mobile/fenix/issues/9746

judge2020 7y ago
You could reliably say that the addition of NoScript(?) would drastically improve page load times, but of course, that only goes to show how slow most website JS is.
- bscphil 7y ago
  That's right, though of course NoScript etc ran on the previous FFA, so it's presumably not relevant to the comparison.
- TylerE 7y ago
  An extension that replaces every response with <html></html> will also drastically improve load times.
TheAdamAndChe 7y ago
In human communication, speech is generally categorized into either conveyance of information or conveyance of emotion. My comment was the latter. I wasn't trying to write a dissertation on exactly how much faster or slower Firefox Preview is. I installed an app, perceived it as faster, and conveyed my emotional response, as indicated with my choice of language such as "holy cow" and "I wish I had tried it earlier." Perception is all that matters with software anyway. Even if it isn't technically faster, it can still be better if it feels faster, which it does to me.
- bscphil 7y ago
  For sure - I'm glad you're enjoying the new Firefox. One issue, though, is that you didn't use the word "faster" in your comment, you just said it was "a stark improvement". I guess what I'm concerned is illustrated by the following thought experiment. Suppose you took the old Firefox for Android code base, and re-released it as "Firefox Preview" with a prominent badge "now 20% faster!". Would you see glowing reports by users on forums talking about how much better it is? I think you would. The only way around that (as far as I can see) is to try to do objective measurements or screen recordings and find out if there's a real difference. Again, not intending to put a damper on your personal experience with and enjoyment of the new browser. Just some thoughts about what's a fairly common comment on articles like this one.
  - bscphil 6y ago
    Kinda funny that a bunch of accounts came through and downvoted everything I said, in this thread, whereas my comments were previously highly upvoted. I'll take the fact that no one has bothered giving any kind of counter-argument as strong confirming evidence that I'm right, but touching a nerve someone has. So thanks for that!
    - TheAdamAndChe 6y ago
      If I argued with everyone willing to argue with me, I would never stop typing. I explained how my comment wasn't a technical comment yet you still tried to talk technicalities with me, so I disengaged. Btw if you take "nobody argued with me" as evidence that you're right, you're gonna end up with a warped worldview.
nicoburns 6y ago
Its UI performance, specifically scrolling is hugely improved. Not quite on a par with Chrome/Brave still unfortunately. But it's greatly improved.
- bscphil 6y ago
  Do you have any objective evidence of this? Like, a screen recording comparing the two?

judge2020 7y ago

You could reliably say that the addition of NoScript(?) would drastically improve page load times, but of course, that only goes to show how slow most website JS is.

bscphil 7y ago
That's right, though of course NoScript etc ran on the previous FFA, so it's presumably not relevant to the comparison.
TylerE 7y ago
An extension that replaces every response with <html></html> will also drastically improve load times.

TheAdamAndChe 7y ago

In human communication, speech is generally categorized into either conveyance of information or conveyance of emotion. My comment was the latter. I wasn't trying to write a dissertation on exactly how much faster or slower Firefox Preview is. I installed an app, perceived it as faster, and conveyed my emotional response, as indicated with my choice of language such as "holy cow" and "I wish I had tried it earlier." Perception is all that matters with software anyway. Even if it isn't technically faster, it can still be better if it feels faster, which it does to me.

bscphil 7y ago
For sure - I'm glad you're enjoying the new Firefox. One issue, though, is that you didn't use the word "faster" in your comment, you just said it was "a stark improvement". I guess what I'm concerned is illustrated by the following thought experiment. Suppose you took the old Firefox for Android code base, and re-released it as "Firefox Preview" with a prominent badge "now 20% faster!". Would you see glowing reports by users on forums talking about how much better it is? I think you would. The only way around that (as far as I can see) is to try to do objective measurements or screen recordings and find out if there's a real difference. Again, not intending to put a damper on your personal experience with and enjoyment of the new browser. Just some thoughts about what's a fairly common comment on articles like this one.
- bscphil 6y ago
  Kinda funny that a bunch of accounts came through and downvoted everything I said, in this thread, whereas my comments were previously highly upvoted. I'll take the fact that no one has bothered giving any kind of counter-argument as strong confirming evidence that I'm right, but touching a nerve someone has. So thanks for that!
  - TheAdamAndChe 6y ago
    If I argued with everyone willing to argue with me, I would never stop typing. I explained how my comment wasn't a technical comment yet you still tried to talk technicalities with me, so I disengaged. Btw if you take "nobody argued with me" as evidence that you're right, you're gonna end up with a warped worldview.

nicoburns 6y ago

Its UI performance, specifically scrolling is hugely improved. Not quite on a par with Chrome/Brave still unfortunately. But it's greatly improved.

bscphil 6y ago
Do you have any objective evidence of this? Like, a screen recording comparing the two?