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> the new inverted-"T" arrangement for the arrow keys makes them easier to find, whether users are navigating through spreadsheets or playing games. Magic Keybo

> the new inverted-"T" arrangement for the arrow keys makes them easier to find, whether users are navigating through spreadsheets or playing games. Magic Keyboard also features a physical Escape key Step 1: Remove features and call it an innovative new design. Step 2: Add those same features back in and act like it is an innovative new design.

codeulike 6y ago
Sustainable innovation
stetrain 6y ago
Alternatively, listening to user feedback and specifically addressing points of criticism in the announcement.
- sumedh 6y ago
  I just dont understand why would Apple with its billion of dollars for R&D would think removing the physical escape button and T arrangement would not cause any negative experience for its users.
  - stinos 6y ago
    R&D Most (?) human's middle fingers are longer than the surrounding ones so from the ergonomic point of view an inverted T is the only thing which makes sense. Getting your middle finger on the same row as the other 2, or the row above, feels ok. Row below feels awkward. Multiple buttons on same row as well unless the keys are quite big: middle fingers are also not very small. It's likely also why an inverted T is the de facto standard for 'normal' keyboards I guess. So one can only wonder why anyone would ever do that differently. Just for the sake of being different and the revenue that might bring? Which would be a bit of a shame for a company which takes pride in design.
- TheSpiceIsLife 6y ago
  Absurd. There’s a word for this: Gaslighting. Inverted-T arrow key arrangement? No no, that’s new.
  - stetrain 6y ago
    Nothing in the announcement says it's novel, innovative, or created by Apple. It says that it's new (as in a change for this model) and better for users. Those two items, inverted-T arrows and an escape key, are very specific user complaint points about their keyboards since 2016. Apple didn't get rid of them in some conspiracy to look like the good guys in 2020 after four years of user complaints. Did you want Tim Cook to appear in a video groveling for forgiveness?
    - TheSpiceIsLife 6y ago
      It’s not new, it’s an old, time tested design and they fucked up by changing it, and it’s okay to admit that. Calling “new” comes across as, I was going to say “intentionally deceptive”, but it’s not deceptive, it’s just lying to your customers. > Apple didn't get rid of them in some conspiracy to look like the good guys in 2020 after four years of user complaints. I’m not convinced. > Did you want Tim Cook to appear in a video groveling for forgiveness? I wouldn’t be offended if he resigned.
      - stetrain 6y ago
        Which company says "We fucked up, our old product was flawed and bad" in a press release? For reference here's the iPhone 4S press release after the "antennagate" iPhone 4: > Improving on the innovative stainless steel external, dual-antenna design of iPhone 4, iPhone 4S is the first phone to intelligently switch between two antennas to send and receive. Smoothing over the flaws in your previous product by focusing on the new and improved version is about as standard marketing-speak as it gets.
        TheSpiceIsLife 6y ago
        Okay.
Karupan 6y ago
And add a “magic” everywhere possible for good measure.
- TheSpiceIsLife 6y ago
  Magic the Gaslighting
maxwellito 6y ago
Next innovation: Function keys. "At Apple, we realised the touch was mostly used to trigger the same actions, and we wondered how we could provide a better experience. Then after years of research, crafting the best design, we created the Function Keys. Instead of the touch bar, there would be a row of physical keys to change the volume, the brightness, and media controls."
ntsplnkv2 6y ago
Step 3: Comments on HN getting about marketing material as if Apple is the only company that does it.
- stetrain 6y ago
  TIL that downplaying the the flaws of your previous product in an official marketing release is Gaslighting.
TheSpiceIsLife 6y ago
> the new inverted-"T" arrangement I bet whoever wrote that sleeps well at night. Bill Hicks: By the way if anyone here is in advertising or marketing… kill yourself… No really, there’s no rationalization for what you do and you are Satan’s little helpers. Okay – kill yourself – seriously. You are the ruiner of all things good, seriously. No this is not a joke, you’re going, “there’s going to be a joke coming,” there’s no fucking joke coming. You are Satan’s spawn filling the world with bile and garbage. You are fucked and you are fucking us. Kill yourself. It’s the only way to save your fucking soul, kill yourself… I know what all the marketing people are thinking right now too, “Oh, you know what Bill’s doing, he’s going for that anti-marketing dollar. That’s a good market, he’s very smart.”…Goddamnit, I’m not doing that, you scum-bags! Quit putting a goddamn dollar sign on every fucking thing on this planet!

codeulike 6y ago

Sustainable innovation

stetrain 6y ago

Alternatively, listening to user feedback and specifically addressing points of criticism in the announcement.

sumedh 6y ago
I just dont understand why would Apple with its billion of dollars for R&D would think removing the physical escape button and T arrangement would not cause any negative experience for its users.
- stinos 6y ago
  R&D Most (?) human's middle fingers are longer than the surrounding ones so from the ergonomic point of view an inverted T is the only thing which makes sense. Getting your middle finger on the same row as the other 2, or the row above, feels ok. Row below feels awkward. Multiple buttons on same row as well unless the keys are quite big: middle fingers are also not very small. It's likely also why an inverted T is the de facto standard for 'normal' keyboards I guess. So one can only wonder why anyone would ever do that differently. Just for the sake of being different and the revenue that might bring? Which would be a bit of a shame for a company which takes pride in design.
TheSpiceIsLife 6y ago
Absurd. There’s a word for this: Gaslighting. Inverted-T arrow key arrangement? No no, that’s new.
- stetrain 6y ago
  Nothing in the announcement says it's novel, innovative, or created by Apple. It says that it's new (as in a change for this model) and better for users. Those two items, inverted-T arrows and an escape key, are very specific user complaint points about their keyboards since 2016. Apple didn't get rid of them in some conspiracy to look like the good guys in 2020 after four years of user complaints. Did you want Tim Cook to appear in a video groveling for forgiveness?
  - TheSpiceIsLife 6y ago
    It’s not new, it’s an old, time tested design and they fucked up by changing it, and it’s okay to admit that. Calling “new” comes across as, I was going to say “intentionally deceptive”, but it’s not deceptive, it’s just lying to your customers. > Apple didn't get rid of them in some conspiracy to look like the good guys in 2020 after four years of user complaints. I’m not convinced. > Did you want Tim Cook to appear in a video groveling for forgiveness? I wouldn’t be offended if he resigned.
    - stetrain 6y ago
      Which company says "We fucked up, our old product was flawed and bad" in a press release? For reference here's the iPhone 4S press release after the "antennagate" iPhone 4: > Improving on the innovative stainless steel external, dual-antenna design of iPhone 4, iPhone 4S is the first phone to intelligently switch between two antennas to send and receive. Smoothing over the flaws in your previous product by focusing on the new and improved version is about as standard marketing-speak as it gets.
      - TheSpiceIsLife 6y ago
        Okay.

Karupan 6y ago

And add a “magic” everywhere possible for good measure.

TheSpiceIsLife 6y ago
Magic the Gaslighting

maxwellito 6y ago

Next innovation: Function keys. "At Apple, we realised the touch was mostly used to trigger the same actions, and we wondered how we could provide a better experience. Then after years of research, crafting the best design, we created the Function Keys. Instead of the touch bar, there would be a row of physical keys to change the volume, the brightness, and media controls."

ntsplnkv2 6y ago

Step 3: Comments on HN getting about marketing material as if Apple is the only company that does it.

stetrain 6y ago
TIL that downplaying the the flaws of your previous product in an official marketing release is Gaslighting.

TheSpiceIsLife 6y ago

> the new inverted-"T" arrangement I bet whoever wrote that sleeps well at night. Bill Hicks: By the way if anyone here is in advertising or marketing… kill yourself… No really, there’s no rationalization for what you do and you are Satan’s little helpers. Okay – kill yourself – seriously. You are the ruiner of all things good, seriously. No this is not a joke, you’re going, “there’s going to be a joke coming,” there’s no fucking joke coming. You are Satan’s spawn filling the world with bile and garbage. You are fucked and you are fucking us. Kill yourself. It’s the only way to save your fucking soul, kill yourself… I know what all the marketing people are thinking right now too, “Oh, you know what Bill’s doing, he’s going for that anti-marketing dollar. That’s a good market, he’s very smart.”…Goddamnit, I’m not doing that, you scum-bags! Quit putting a goddamn dollar sign on every fucking thing on this planet!