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>If you attend in person, you have to do tons of assignments, labs, exams Exactly. Even as a self-taught developer, one of my biggest regrets is how little I a

by zelos 6y ago

>If you attend in person, you have to do tons of assignments, labs, exams Exactly. Even as a self-taught developer, one of my biggest regrets is how little I appreciated the incredible resources I had available at university and didn't really take advantage of or appreciate.

wolfgke 6y ago
For me, it rather was "I had so much to do for courses that I had hardly any time to make use of or appreciate the incredible amount of ressources."
whymauri 6y ago
Also, a lot of classes are essentially impossible online. Intense lab courses, term-long project courses, and time-sensitive experimentation courses are all screwed. The way classes are coping is interesting: 1. For classes requiring user testing or behavioral experiments, assignments are being processed through mechanical turk. 2. The experimental physics lab is changing from a 'choose-your-own-adventure' model of choosing a final project to a satellite/telemetry/astronomy project. 3. Some classes are providing synthetic datasets or data from previous semesters for lab classes. 4. Some classes are basically finished. It is actually impossible to continue teaching them, so they're purely instructional or seminars, at this point. A lot of these lab classes are required to graduate, too. They also require so many resources that they can only be taught once a year. It's seriously demotivating, especially for passionate hands-on learners. And paying sticker price doesn't help the sting for many students.
- ghaff 6y ago
  Medium to large lecture classes can probably work pretty well. As can mostly small seminars I would think. Other things are tough or impossible. For example, I had an undergraduate thesis in my major, which required being physically in a lab and having access to a machine shop. In any case, there are lab/project classes throughout a lot of STEM majors that students aren't going to be able to reasonably finish this semester. I don't know how this is being typically handled with everyone having to drop things ~ 1 month into the semester.
gen220 6y ago
About halfway through my college experience, I switched gears from extreme attendance-and-attentive-note-taking to extreme self-teaching, out of necessity (I was taking too many classes and working simultaneously, so I didn't have time to attend each lecture each week). Of course, I still did the homework assignments, studied for exams, etc. Except for the occasional "gotchas" where professors say something random in class that shows up on the exam, it didn't adversely impact my GPA, and it saved a ton of time. I think I learned more efficiently on my own, which led to saving a ton of time shuffling from physical location to physical location. It freed up more time for working, exercising, and sleeping. Given this experience, in retrospect, I think the most valuable parts of my education were not necessarily the classroom, but rather: 50%: The (well-written) syllabi. They point out which resources (books, blogs, websites, etc) are worth your time, if you have an interest in the subject. The best ones are filled with opinions, and "optional resources if you want to dive deeper into X". Even the lazily-constructed ones are a great foundation if you have no idea about how to begin learning X. 25%: The classmates and TAs. Oral/written feedback, delivered efficiently and with empathy is not essential, but a great catalyst to development. This one's a bit personality-dependent, for other's it might be higher or lower. 25%: The assignments, projects, and deadline pressure. To learn things, you really need time-spaced practice. Reading is not sufficient. The deadline and grade pressures erode as you get better, but they're invaluable early on. I think that you can get 90% of each of these online, just fine. But that's me! It might require personal conversation for others, but in my experience a good collection of reading and tasks, some form of IRC, and rudimentary deadline pressure are more than sufficient to replace the classroom for self-starting individuals. I think Coursera's relative success proven that case.
- JadeNB 6y ago
  > 50%: The (well-written) syllabi. They point out which resources (books, blogs, websites, etc) are worth your time, if you have an interest in the subject. The best ones are filled with opinions, and "optional resources if you want to dive deeper into X". Even the lazily-constructed ones are a great foundation if you have no idea about how to begin learning X. Do you have any pointers to online examples of syllabi you found useful? My syllabi are always to the point and focussed on the structure of the class; it's never occurred to me that someone might want to use them as a roadmap for independent learning, and I'd be interested in facilitating that.

by zelos 6y ago

wolfgke 6y ago

For me, it rather was "I had so much to do for courses that I had hardly any time to make use of or appreciate the incredible amount of ressources."

whymauri 6y ago

Also, a lot of classes are essentially impossible online. Intense lab courses, term-long project courses, and time-sensitive experimentation courses are all screwed. The way classes are coping is interesting: 1. For classes requiring user testing or behavioral experiments, assignments are being processed through mechanical turk. 2. The experimental physics lab is changing from a 'choose-your-own-adventure' model of choosing a final project to a satellite/telemetry/astronomy project. 3. Some classes are providing synthetic datasets or data from previous semesters for lab classes. 4. Some classes are basically finished. It is actually impossible to continue teaching them, so they're purely instructional or seminars, at this point. A lot of these lab classes are required to graduate, too. They also require so many resources that they can only be taught once a year. It's seriously demotivating, especially for passionate hands-on learners. And paying sticker price doesn't help the sting for many students.

ghaff 6y ago
Medium to large lecture classes can probably work pretty well. As can mostly small seminars I would think. Other things are tough or impossible. For example, I had an undergraduate thesis in my major, which required being physically in a lab and having access to a machine shop. In any case, there are lab/project classes throughout a lot of STEM majors that students aren't going to be able to reasonably finish this semester. I don't know how this is being typically handled with everyone having to drop things ~ 1 month into the semester.

gen220 6y ago

About halfway through my college experience, I switched gears from extreme attendance-and-attentive-note-taking to extreme self-teaching, out of necessity (I was taking too many classes and working simultaneously, so I didn't have time to attend each lecture each week). Of course, I still did the homework assignments, studied for exams, etc. Except for the occasional "gotchas" where professors say something random in class that shows up on the exam, it didn't adversely impact my GPA, and it saved a ton of time. I think I learned more efficiently on my own, which led to saving a ton of time shuffling from physical location to physical location. It freed up more time for working, exercising, and sleeping. Given this experience, in retrospect, I think the most valuable parts of my education were not necessarily the classroom, but rather: 50%: The (well-written) syllabi. They point out which resources (books, blogs, websites, etc) are worth your time, if you have an interest in the subject. The best ones are filled with opinions, and "optional resources if you want to dive deeper into X". Even the lazily-constructed ones are a great foundation if you have no idea about how to begin learning X. 25%: The classmates and TAs. Oral/written feedback, delivered efficiently and with empathy is not essential, but a great catalyst to development. This one's a bit personality-dependent, for other's it might be higher or lower. 25%: The assignments, projects, and deadline pressure. To learn things, you really need time-spaced practice. Reading is not sufficient. The deadline and grade pressures erode as you get better, but they're invaluable early on. I think that you can get 90% of each of these online, just fine. But that's me! It might require personal conversation for others, but in my experience a good collection of reading and tasks, some form of IRC, and rudimentary deadline pressure are more than sufficient to replace the classroom for self-starting individuals. I think Coursera's relative success proven that case.

JadeNB 6y ago
> 50%: The (well-written) syllabi. They point out which resources (books, blogs, websites, etc) are worth your time, if you have an interest in the subject. The best ones are filled with opinions, and "optional resources if you want to dive deeper into X". Even the lazily-constructed ones are a great foundation if you have no idea about how to begin learning X. Do you have any pointers to online examples of syllabi you found useful? My syllabi are always to the point and focussed on the structure of the class; it's never occurred to me that someone might want to use them as a roadmap for independent learning, and I'd be interested in facilitating that.