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I totally agree that software is worth paying for, especially at 5$, but what is it that rubs the wrong way about this? It's so irritating. Developer tools shou

by cschep 16y ago

I totally agree that software is worth paying for, especially at 5$, but what is it that rubs the wrong way about this? It's so irritating. Developer tools should be free. Charge more for something else! If I may quote PG: "They make such great stuff, but they're such assholes. Do I really want to support this company?" This is only getting more and more true. Stop it Apple!

scott_s 16y ago
I want to point out Visual Studio (http://www.microsoft.com/visualstudio/en-us/ http://www.microsoft.com/visualstudio/en-us/), but I don't know how it compares. The Express version is free, but the "Utlimate" version is almost $12,000. There are "Premium" and "Professional" below that. I don't know how the features of the various versions compare to XCode.
- benologist 16y ago
  I couldn't do a feature by feature comparison but generally speaking if you're not in a team you can go pretty far on the express editions. The express edition of SQL Server is also good.
ptomato 16y ago
I'm pretty sure that the only reason they're charging for it is because they feel they're obligated to by accounting requirements. Same reason they charge for Facetime. I'd wager Xcode 4 will be included for free with Lion, just like Facetime will be.
- tolmasky 16y ago
  I highly doubt it. This is not some part of the OS or something, this is a standalone product and it is still OK in the US to have products that are free. Also, they've been giving xcode away for free for a decade, long after this accounting practices thing came up.
  - ptomato 16y ago
    Actually, they've been including Xcode with the OS and giving away minor updates for free. History of Xcode, every new major version was released with an OS and would not run on the previous versions of Mac OS X. See also: iPod Touch until recently. Major updates cost some nominal amount of money, minor updates are free.
    - __david__ 16y ago
      Yeah, which I think invalidates your accounting hypothesis. If accounting is the reason for the cost then they would have already been charging for it.
      - ptomato 16y ago
        No, because they were distributing it as part of the operating system, which they sold.
jonny_eh 16y ago
Why should dev tools be free? Adobe's whole business is selling dev tools. Should Adobe stop selling Flash Builder and instead sell Flash Player? Dev tools should only be free when the platform owner is desperate for developers. This used to be true for Apple, but not any more!
- cschep 16y ago
  Adobe sucks.
deleted 16y ago
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daemin 16y ago
Well there's a limit to how many developer tools should be free. If you're talking about the basic command line utilities and libraries that you use to build applications, then yes, they should be free. If you're talking about a fully featured IDE with all the bells and whistles, stuff that can refactor code easily, has a decent built in build system. Then no, you shouldn't expect it to be free.

by cschep 16y ago

scott_s 16y ago

I want to point out Visual Studio (http://www.microsoft.com/visualstudio/en-us/ http://www.microsoft.com/visualstudio/en-us/), but I don't know how it compares. The Express version is free, but the "Utlimate" version is almost $12,000. There are "Premium" and "Professional" below that. I don't know how the features of the various versions compare to XCode.

benologist 16y ago
I couldn't do a feature by feature comparison but generally speaking if you're not in a team you can go pretty far on the express editions. The express edition of SQL Server is also good.

ptomato 16y ago

I'm pretty sure that the only reason they're charging for it is because they feel they're obligated to by accounting requirements. Same reason they charge for Facetime. I'd wager Xcode 4 will be included for free with Lion, just like Facetime will be.

tolmasky 16y ago
I highly doubt it. This is not some part of the OS or something, this is a standalone product and it is still OK in the US to have products that are free. Also, they've been giving xcode away for free for a decade, long after this accounting practices thing came up.
- ptomato 16y ago
  Actually, they've been including Xcode with the OS and giving away minor updates for free. History of Xcode, every new major version was released with an OS and would not run on the previous versions of Mac OS X. See also: iPod Touch until recently. Major updates cost some nominal amount of money, minor updates are free.
  - __david__ 16y ago
    Yeah, which I think invalidates your accounting hypothesis. If accounting is the reason for the cost then they would have already been charging for it.
    - ptomato 16y ago
      No, because they were distributing it as part of the operating system, which they sold.

jonny_eh 16y ago

Why should dev tools be free? Adobe's whole business is selling dev tools. Should Adobe stop selling Flash Builder and instead sell Flash Player? Dev tools should only be free when the platform owner is desperate for developers. This used to be true for Apple, but not any more!

cschep 16y ago
Adobe sucks.

deleted 16y ago

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daemin 16y ago

Well there's a limit to how many developer tools should be free. If you're talking about the basic command line utilities and libraries that you use to build applications, then yes, they should be free. If you're talking about a fully featured IDE with all the bells and whistles, stuff that can refactor code easily, has a decent built in build system. Then no, you shouldn't expect it to be free.