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i applaud your effort to break out of your bubble, and to that end, make these observations: "regardless of their culture" -> that's othering. you could substi

i applaud your effort to break out of your bubble, and to that end, make these observations: "regardless of their culture" -> that's othering. you could substitute "regarless of our cultural differences" and be less confrontational in that regard. "Some folks are stunned when I 'see' them. People from different cultures are accustomed to being invisible." -> why you, and again, why is it your culture vs. theirs? why would they be invisible and not you? culture is shared, and the effects of your (new) actions is to create that shared culture. perceiving 'other' cultures this way is antagonistic. other people feel that, even if they are otherwise polite and welcoming.

JoeAltmaier 7y ago
Because I am the mainstream culture, they are the ones who are accustomed to being invisible. I am anything but invisible - 6'4" 230lbs white male - everybody sees me come into the room. And yes folks from other countries recently arrived are correctly described as having 'a different culture'. Else the word 'culture' loses all meaning. I'm sympathetic to efforts to diminish 'them' vs 'us. But the topic here is exactly that, and its appropriate to call it out.
- clairity 7y ago
  you're certainly welcome to take that stance, but it will hinder positive change, as other people catch on to the undercurrent of difference and superiority. you may also want to ask a bunch of immigrants and "others" about whether they feel invisible before projecting. our brains are biased toward remembering the unique, not the common. that's why people focus on differences incessantly, not commonalities. white men are ~1/3 of the US population.
  - JoeAltmaier 7y ago
    Its obvious they do feel invisible. Firstly, its well documented (books, movies, studies). They respond as if startled, sometimes stammer and have trouble responding. As opposed to other folks who respond fluidly, as if social contact is not unexpected. I'm not opposed to anything you say. But the conversation can't be had without saying this stuff out loud. And hindering conversation is an order of magnitude larger problem, than pedantry about terminology.
    - clairity 7y ago
      agreed that hindering conversations is counter-productive. hopefully that wasn't the received intent. here are my observations living in a diverse neighborhood: white folks, black folks, east asians, mexicans, central americans, south asians, pacific islanders, etc. the black folks observably feel hyper-scrutinized. east/south asians tend to be reserved. mexicans and central americans are congenial, though sometimes guarded because of language/immigration issues. in nearly all cases i can think of, no one feels invisible, but rather visibly, palpably different, like a spotlight is shining on them everywhere they go. they're sometimes nervous because they're trying so hard to fit in, not because they feel invisible.
      - JoeAltmaier 7y ago
        I could be interpreting it wrong - folks are nervous because they generally don't have favorable conversations with 6'4" white guys. I used the 'invisible' label because its how some folks, notably older women, describe how they feel. But that's a reach and I apologize if I got it wrong.
        clairity 7y ago
        yes, certainly older women feel more invisible on average across all cultures. and it's totally possible that many of the people you meet do feel invisible; i was only suggesting not to presume it, given the diversity of experiences.

JoeAltmaier 7y ago

Because I am the mainstream culture, they are the ones who are accustomed to being invisible. I am anything but invisible - 6'4" 230lbs white male - everybody sees me come into the room. And yes folks from other countries recently arrived are correctly described as having 'a different culture'. Else the word 'culture' loses all meaning. I'm sympathetic to efforts to diminish 'them' vs 'us. But the topic here is exactly that, and its appropriate to call it out.

clairity 7y ago
you're certainly welcome to take that stance, but it will hinder positive change, as other people catch on to the undercurrent of difference and superiority. you may also want to ask a bunch of immigrants and "others" about whether they feel invisible before projecting. our brains are biased toward remembering the unique, not the common. that's why people focus on differences incessantly, not commonalities. white men are ~1/3 of the US population.
- JoeAltmaier 7y ago
  Its obvious they do feel invisible. Firstly, its well documented (books, movies, studies). They respond as if startled, sometimes stammer and have trouble responding. As opposed to other folks who respond fluidly, as if social contact is not unexpected. I'm not opposed to anything you say. But the conversation can't be had without saying this stuff out loud. And hindering conversation is an order of magnitude larger problem, than pedantry about terminology.
  - clairity 7y ago
    agreed that hindering conversations is counter-productive. hopefully that wasn't the received intent. here are my observations living in a diverse neighborhood: white folks, black folks, east asians, mexicans, central americans, south asians, pacific islanders, etc. the black folks observably feel hyper-scrutinized. east/south asians tend to be reserved. mexicans and central americans are congenial, though sometimes guarded because of language/immigration issues. in nearly all cases i can think of, no one feels invisible, but rather visibly, palpably different, like a spotlight is shining on them everywhere they go. they're sometimes nervous because they're trying so hard to fit in, not because they feel invisible.
    - JoeAltmaier 7y ago
      I could be interpreting it wrong - folks are nervous because they generally don't have favorable conversations with 6'4" white guys. I used the 'invisible' label because its how some folks, notably older women, describe how they feel. But that's a reach and I apologize if I got it wrong.
      - clairity 7y ago
        yes, certainly older women feel more invisible on average across all cultures. and it's totally possible that many of the people you meet do feel invisible; i was only suggesting not to presume it, given the diversity of experiences.