4 ms·
Gamedev here. A different perspective: 1. Social vs goal driven is a false dichotomy: multiplayer games are always both. In any player population you're going
by 60654 6y ago
Gamedev here. A different perspective:
1. Social vs goal driven is a false dichotomy: multiplayer games are always both. In any player population you're going to get a mix of players driven by social and creative elements, driven by competition, driven by exploration, etc (cf. Bartle types or Yee player motivation taxonomy).
You can try to encourage some play types over others, but it's really hard to do a game that's social first, just because social by itself doesn't drive retention and acquisition enough: you need something else for players to do to have fun while they're also having fun socializing.
History of gamedev is full of social-first environments, from legions of old MUDs, to Second Life or There, to IMVU, etc. They never reached the same heights as MMO games because it's hard to make a game "sticky" without having the game there.
2. Building a platform first, and then building a game on it, is a quick way to lose all your money. Building a game first and then extending it to a platform is the correct direction, because if you don't have a game, you won't have users, see what works, etc. And until you have users, you don't know what players want from a platform.
3. "Still, it’s clear that we want to come together, not just in Instagram DMs and email threads, but as avatars navigating shared spaces. Somehow." That's just plainly false. Players are completely happy with social interactions without avatars, without 3d space, etc. There are many ways to make games more social, as gamedevs know well.
- randall 6y agofwiw you're absolutely right. I didn't read the OP, but this is totally directionally accurate as far as I've experienced.
- codewithcheese 6y ago>just because social by itself doesn't drive retention and acquisition enough: you need something else for players to do to have fun while they're also having fun socializing. that's also why people like to drink, or do anything else while being social :) I think we have not even mastered being social AFK without playing a game! AFK = away from keyboard, i prefer that over IRL (in real life) since being at the computer is still real life
- DonHopkins 6y agoYou and Peter Sunde! ;) https://gizmodo.com/pirate-bay-trial-watch-day-5-omg-is-this-happening-ir-5157197 https://gizmodo.com/pirate-bay-trial-watch-day-5-omg-is-this... >The torrent trial of the century continues, and today, there are some pretty shocking revelations about just how much the prosecution knows. Is that a tinge of remorse I hear from The Pirate Bay dudes? >• The Pirate Bay's Peter Sunde (aka brokep) doesn't like copyright! "I like things that are not protected by copyright, this is a non-issue." >• The prosecutor knows the secret code for talking on the internets! "When did you meet [Gottfrid] for the first time IRL?" The judge asks, "IRL?" The prosecutor, being with it, coolly informs the judge it means "in real life," sucka. >• Oh snap, maybe he doesn't! The Pirate Bay's Peter responds, "We do not use the expression IRL." No, everything is in real life. We use AFK—away from keyboard." This makes for a sad prosecutor: "It seems I am a little bit out of date."
- resu_nimda 6y agoFor my money, Star Wars Galaxies is the gold standard here, imo that game was far ahead of its time, and we will start to see more games like that in the future (I honestly feel like WoW set the genre back by 10-20 years). It was the perfect mix of social and gameplay, that enticed a broad range of player-types to come together and create little virtual worlds where stories could unfold. Of course EVE has done some truly remarkable work in this realm as well but it's definitely not enough "gameplay" for your average gamer.
- pjc50 6y agoYes, I was looking for mention of the Bartle EASK types and the synergy. Virtual socialisation with no proxy activity is just Zoom. > "Still, it’s clear that we want to come together, not just in Instagram DMs and email threads, but as avatars navigating shared spaces. Somehow." That's just plainly false Agree. If anything, avatars in spaces is the one thing that's been tried a lot and doesn't quite work. Second Life is still there if you want it.
- Pamar 6y agoI spent a considerable amount of time in Second Life ... 15 years ago. The place was teeming with users that had left Star Wars Galaxies and were happy with the social interaction in SL. So maybe the early version of Star Wars had the best balance between social and gaming elements? I ask because I never played it so I cannot judge, but looks like it originally catered for a larger group of differentiser types. Edit: I forgot that the full name was SW Galaxies...
- judge2020 6y ago> "Still, it’s clear that we want to come together, not just in Instagram DMs and email threads, but as avatars navigating shared spaces. Somehow." That's just plainly false. Neither the article nor anybody here has mentioned it, but VRChat is the only one of these games that seem to work. All you do is walk around as an avatar talking with other players with their own character avatars (note these are often characters from other IP, there isn't an avatar creator like you would have in the Sims or anything like that).
- gfodor 6y agoI think what we've been seeing with hubs.mozilla.com is the threshold for "game" can be quite low. People need something to do, yes, but what this is could be barely game-like: give them a few ways to create objects, draw, etc, and that might be good enough.
- JoeAltmaier 6y agoStill it seems a squandered opportunity. Instagram is no substitute for shared spaces. And 'gamedevs know' about blockbuster team-based shooters, and a very few other big sellers. Remember, most people don't play video games at all. What would they find appealing? Clearly, not what gamedevs are delivering.