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"Idiotic" is a strong word. The question is: if candidate A answers these successfully, and candidate B does not, is there a reason to believe that candidate A

"Idiotic" is a strong word. The question is: if candidate A answers these successfully, and candidate B does not, is there a reason to believe that candidate A is a better fit for your SQL data analyst position? You may say no, that any competent person can read the book and learn this stuff. But in my hiring experience there are sadly oceans of coders who, say, reach for 100 lines of buggy slow Java code to solve something that could be done in 3 lines of SQL. Once you've hired that person they do not magically turn into an efficient or self-aware programmer.

mellow2020 6y ago
> there are sadly oceans of coders who, say, reach for 100 lines of buggy slow Java code to solve something that could be done in 3 lines of SQL Such questions don't test for that, they test for rote memorization. I don't learn things by heart I only use rarely, and certainly not to help you with a problem I'm not causing and that such memorization doesn't fix.
TheBobinator 6y ago
First of all, in your example, the DB server is doing the other 97 lines of work that java had to do; one approach uses data structures the other uses a SDE designed for data management and access. I think most employers would prefer a developer that can do both. Second, the most important skill to DBA or Data Scientist role and to an employer is finding someone that understands the data domain well enough to point out obvious mistakes, bad approaches and thinking to managers and provide leadership, not just access, to information. Third, "any competent person" is just belittling a skillset that, like programming, can take years or decades to truly understand.
foxyv 6y ago
I agree with most of what you are saying. But sometimes it's better to go with Java code instead of creating 3 line SQL commands. Then again, this depends a lot on your architecture. For instance, if your database is running on expensive hardware with very limited CPU and memory quotas then often it's better to export intensive problems to the application. Also a lot of the more complicated SQL commands are implemented differently in all the dialects of MySQL, MSSQL, Oracle and DB2. Sticking to simpler queries lends itself to cross platform compatibility if you need that. I think that when you run into someone who knows these in depth things about SQL you either have a smart technically aware person or a rote learner. I think the best bet is to ask them how they would use the different stuff and why. Rote learners will hit a brick wall or answer generically.

mellow2020 6y ago

> there are sadly oceans of coders who, say, reach for 100 lines of buggy slow Java code to solve something that could be done in 3 lines of SQL Such questions don't test for that, they test for rote memorization. I don't learn things by heart I only use rarely, and certainly not to help you with a problem I'm not causing and that such memorization doesn't fix.

TheBobinator 6y ago

First of all, in your example, the DB server is doing the other 97 lines of work that java had to do; one approach uses data structures the other uses a SDE designed for data management and access. I think most employers would prefer a developer that can do both. Second, the most important skill to DBA or Data Scientist role and to an employer is finding someone that understands the data domain well enough to point out obvious mistakes, bad approaches and thinking to managers and provide leadership, not just access, to information. Third, "any competent person" is just belittling a skillset that, like programming, can take years or decades to truly understand.

foxyv 6y ago

I agree with most of what you are saying. But sometimes it's better to go with Java code instead of creating 3 line SQL commands. Then again, this depends a lot on your architecture. For instance, if your database is running on expensive hardware with very limited CPU and memory quotas then often it's better to export intensive problems to the application. Also a lot of the more complicated SQL commands are implemented differently in all the dialects of MySQL, MSSQL, Oracle and DB2. Sticking to simpler queries lends itself to cross platform compatibility if you need that. I think that when you run into someone who knows these in depth things about SQL you either have a smart technically aware person or a rote learner. I think the best bet is to ask them how they would use the different stuff and why. Rote learners will hit a brick wall or answer generically.