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>The implication was that the vast majority of criticism is methodically wrong. Not at all. Only that there is enough to warrant the expression of concern whi

>The implication was that the vast majority of criticism is methodically wrong. Not at all. Only that there is enough to warrant the expression of concern which the GP made. We each have different tolerances. >the US P's supporters were saying that he was referring to "advanced treatments" that detractors were unaware of. Are you viewing US P supporters as a monolith? I heard those claims from some people. I thought it was unlikely because he has demonstrated substantial scientific illiteracy in other situations. Regarding 'sarcasm', I think, most likely, he was saying whatever he thought, at the moment, would help him move on and put that embarrassing situation behind him. >Is the criticism he faced for this valid in your opinion? Which criticism, exactly? Because I saw headlines implying that Trump got up on stage, addressed the American people, and suggested to the American people that they should inject bleach into their bodies to cure this disease. This is a good example of what I'm talking about. The man is not science literate, and he says some amazingly dumb things. You don't have to spin what he says to criticize him, and yet some in the media still dialed it up to 11 and painted a [dishonest] representation of events. Edit: Just to emphasize this, when you ask Is the criticism he faced for this valid in your opinion?, he most definitely deserved to be criticized for what he actually said. The fact that he deserves to be criticized doesn't mean the form, content, and nature of all of the criticism that everyone makes is okay.

osrec 6y ago
The guy is the leader of the free world! He's making random screw ups every few days. He has single handedly turned himself into a joke. If you or me said the things he said, we'd be considered idiots by our peers. We need to exercise a bit of common sense now, and realise that the benefit of the doubt has been granted way too many times for there to be any further doubt that this guy is anything other than a buffoon!
- jshevek 6y ago
  >The guy is the leader of the free world! He's making random screw ups every few days. He has single handedly turned himself into a joke. I wish this site would allow me to self-detach my own sub-thread. There are things I'd like to say which might not be wholly aligned with the site guidelines. At least most people seem to be ignoring our conversation. :) I'll just say that I don't disagree with this sentiment. >If you or me said the things he said, we'd be considered idiots by our peers. Absolutely true. >the benefit of the doubt has been granted way too many times for there to be any further doubt that this guy is anything other than a buffoon! I think you are simply saying that it is well established that Trump is a buffoon. Granting that premise, I still believe we should each investigate the veracity of any subsequent claims about him before accepting them as true. And push back if they prove false.
  - osrec 6y ago
    > I wish this site would allow me to self-detach my own sub-thread. There are things I'd like to say which might not be wholly aligned with the site guidelines. At least most people seem to be ignoring our conversation. :) I'll just say that I don't disagree with this sentiment. Personally, I do not feel no anger or the need to move away from the guidelines; I disagree with you, but that's okay :) Honestly, I was hoping to understand your point of view, while presenting mine. So far, your point of view comes across as: "yes, he may be a buffoon, but the media overplay it, and every new action must be taken on its own merit". I think that's fair enough argument, but you cannot gloss over the "he is a buffoon" bit by defending it using the "the media overplay it, and every new action must be taken on its own merit" bit. I guess what I'm saying is that the US P should not be/come across as a buffoon.
    - jshevek 6y ago
      >So far, your point of view comes across as: "yes, he may be a buffoon, but the media overplay it, and every new action must be taken on its own merit". If the topic is "Is Trump a buffoon?" then yes, that's a fair characterization. It is also my opinion that he is much worse than a buffoon, while also not being nearly as bad as he is often portrayed. >the US P should not be/come across as a buffoon. I agree. >I do not feel no anger or the need to move away from the guidelines I wasn't angry when I wrote that. Just like I can be angry and say something that's clearly not flamebait, I can be dispassionate and say something that is taken as flamebait. Many of my opinions about Trump, both positive and negative, add absolutely nothing of substance to the conversation, I mention some of my negative ones here partly to clarify the boundaries of agreement and disagreement between you and I. >Honestly, I was hoping to understand your point of view, while presenting mine. I appreciate the respectful exchange, and your open mindedness.

osrec 6y ago

The guy is the leader of the free world! He's making random screw ups every few days. He has single handedly turned himself into a joke. If you or me said the things he said, we'd be considered idiots by our peers. We need to exercise a bit of common sense now, and realise that the benefit of the doubt has been granted way too many times for there to be any further doubt that this guy is anything other than a buffoon!

jshevek 6y ago
>The guy is the leader of the free world! He's making random screw ups every few days. He has single handedly turned himself into a joke. I wish this site would allow me to self-detach my own sub-thread. There are things I'd like to say which might not be wholly aligned with the site guidelines. At least most people seem to be ignoring our conversation. :) I'll just say that I don't disagree with this sentiment. >If you or me said the things he said, we'd be considered idiots by our peers. Absolutely true. >the benefit of the doubt has been granted way too many times for there to be any further doubt that this guy is anything other than a buffoon! I think you are simply saying that it is well established that Trump is a buffoon. Granting that premise, I still believe we should each investigate the veracity of any subsequent claims about him before accepting them as true. And push back if they prove false.
- osrec 6y ago
  > I wish this site would allow me to self-detach my own sub-thread. There are things I'd like to say which might not be wholly aligned with the site guidelines. At least most people seem to be ignoring our conversation. :) I'll just say that I don't disagree with this sentiment. Personally, I do not feel no anger or the need to move away from the guidelines; I disagree with you, but that's okay :) Honestly, I was hoping to understand your point of view, while presenting mine. So far, your point of view comes across as: "yes, he may be a buffoon, but the media overplay it, and every new action must be taken on its own merit". I think that's fair enough argument, but you cannot gloss over the "he is a buffoon" bit by defending it using the "the media overplay it, and every new action must be taken on its own merit" bit. I guess what I'm saying is that the US P should not be/come across as a buffoon.
  - jshevek 6y ago
    >So far, your point of view comes across as: "yes, he may be a buffoon, but the media overplay it, and every new action must be taken on its own merit". If the topic is "Is Trump a buffoon?" then yes, that's a fair characterization. It is also my opinion that he is much worse than a buffoon, while also not being nearly as bad as he is often portrayed. >the US P should not be/come across as a buffoon. I agree. >I do not feel no anger or the need to move away from the guidelines I wasn't angry when I wrote that. Just like I can be angry and say something that's clearly not flamebait, I can be dispassionate and say something that is taken as flamebait. Many of my opinions about Trump, both positive and negative, add absolutely nothing of substance to the conversation, I mention some of my negative ones here partly to clarify the boundaries of agreement and disagreement between you and I. >Honestly, I was hoping to understand your point of view, while presenting mine. I appreciate the respectful exchange, and your open mindedness.