10 ms·

People are focused on the relatively small amount here, and that's valid, but I suspect that some of the incentive here is to keep momentum in cycling going (fr

People are focused on the relatively small amount here, and that's valid, but I suspect that some of the incentive here is to keep momentum in cycling going (from people avoiding transit, enjoying temporary bike infra, etc.) and trying not to lose that progress. There might be a lot of people for whom that €50 means a tuneup that gets them to take the bike out when before it would've just rusted. I mean, data would be nice, but that's the hope (I'm guessing)

aplummer 7y ago
If you’re right that money in a public health system will pay back dividends I imagine.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
duxup 7y ago
Is anyone really waiting for €50 to use or not use their bike on a regular basis? I'm highly skeptical. This seems like it will just benefit folks already doing it anyway.
- jxcl 7y ago
  Maybe not, but a properly tuned and lubricated bike is waaaayyyyy more pleasant to ride and may help to encourage increased bike use. It's easier to do stuff when it's pleasant.
- doyoureallytnot 7y ago
  I really think so. We had a pop-up bike repair workshop come around every month at my last place of work and it really increased bike use in the area.
- ploika 7y ago
  Absolutely. There are plenty of people who have a bike with a flat tyre and a rusty chain and no lights or whatever. They might go back to taking the bus or metro, but if they were offered a free service (effectively) to make cycling a viable option, they'll take it. I know loads of people who cycle to work because of Ireland's Bike To Work scheme. They can all afford a bike without help, but the extra incentive was enough to get them to start cycling.
  - wolco 7y ago
    Would they go through all of that in the hopes of getting upto $50.00?
    - fluffything 7y ago
      Through all of what? Walking your bike 200m to the closest bike shop? With 50 EUR, every bike shop does the usual tear fixes: changing tubes, adjusting gears and brake levers, changing break pads, changing the handlebar tape, centering the wheels, and cleaning / oiling. Those 50 EUR can't cover major damage, but lots of people in Europe have multiple bikes in their basement that are just "rusty" / flat tire / etc. and that they didn't needed during the winter.
      - Y-bar 7y ago
        > Walking your bike 200m to the closest bike shop? This also illustrates a secondary benefit of these €50, namely that bike repairs are hyper-local. In addition to making bike repair more affordable for some and helping keep the momentum going on bike commuting, these euros can also drive more commerce to local small repair shops, helping them stay in business.
    - adambard 7y ago
      On July 11, 7-11 offers a free slurpee to all customers. The free slurpee cup is a fraction of the size of any of the already-very-cheap options available for sale. I have seen lineups out the door and around the block on this occasion. I think this illustrates very well people's well-known tendency to irrationally value free stuff.
    - zxexz 7y ago
      I would. I also want to point out that you seem to be trivializing what most people would consider a non-trivial amount of money. That's easily a month of groceries for one person.
      - smeyer 7y ago
doyoureallytnot 7y ago
I think this is exactly it. A lot of people have bikes already but they're a little run down and this might be the encouragement they need to get them fixed. The fact is that most people can't do even the simplest repairs on their own bike and if their bike is run down then they're less likely to use it.
ogre_codes 7y ago
Bikes tend to degrade slowly over time if you don't do regular maintenance. Most people don't notice the slow decline until it's quite bad when suddenly it feels like an unreliable POS. Giving people who are just a little frustrated with their bike might go a long way to helping keep people from getting to that point at least once.
- cultus 7y ago
  This doesn't get enough attention in cycling promotion. One of the absolute biggest reasons that people aren't on their bikes is maintenance. Wheels go out of true, shifting gets wonky, and it starts to look like an unreliable form of transport. Sturdier commuter bikes help a lot with this, but every commuter seems to think they need a bike with super-light wheels and a thin, weak 12-speed chain.
  - ogre_codes 7y ago
    One of the reasons I think people like the bike share programs. The bikes are burly and slow, but they get the maintenance they need where they usually don't end up truly horrible.
    - dmoy 7y ago
      I guess this depends on the bike share program. I've definitely ridden my share of bike share bikes that were in very bad shape (and I have a fairly high tolerance for junkers). The bike share program in question shut down and isn't available in my area anymore, so maybe that was just because they were cutting back.
      - dmurray 7y ago
        The docked bikes in my city have way better build quality and maintenance standards than the undocked ones. They're both heavy but the undocked ones have chains falling off, broken shifters, etc. I expect it makes sense that these get less investment as they are easier to steal.
    - 7y ago
Noos 7y ago
"keeping cycling going" is much less important than spending that money to deal with job loss and unemployment. This is using a crisis to divert money to a person's pet agendas. if you want to subsidize cycling and stuff, can we at least get the economy back up first and deal with the massive fallout from lost wages due to time off, and business closings?
- ploika 7y ago
  Where I live, cycling is much cheaper than public transport and astronomically cheaper than driving. If you have lost wages and still have to go places, that's important. You're assuming that there's a choice between supporting an economic recovery and supporting cycling. I don't believe there is, certainly not when it comes to return on investment for €50 per person. I see increased mobility, decreased congestion in towns and cities, less pollution and less income lost to transport costs, not to mention the health benefits from more exercise.
- icebraining 7y ago
  I don't see a "than" here. These vouchers are also a cash injection into French businesses and workers, and specifically ones who are both important from a policy standpoint and yet likely to get heavily beaten by the crisis, since everyone delays repairs in a crisis.
analog31 7y ago
50 bucks is more than most of my bikes are worth. ;-) But seriously I think that most bikes are within 50 bucks of being rideable. I tinker with a lot of old bikes, for family, friends, and at one time for a charity program. At least in the US, a huge fraction of bikes are gathering dust or rust, but the tires are flat, there's no pump in the house, some of the mechanisms are stuck, they haven't been properly adjusted for comfort, etc. Many of the bikes weren't properly built in the first place, and need attention to things like spoke tension and bearing adjustment. And the owners aren't handy with tools. A bit of lube, air in the tires, and maybe a reassurance from the mechanic at a shop, and some accessories such as a pump, will have the bike up and running. At the very least it will help the shops stay afloat. If the subsidy kicks in all at once for a lot of people, it could trigger a noticeable increase in bike use, which has a crowd psychology benefit. For everybody, my consistent advice is that your experience with any kind of cycling will be greatly improved by becoming self sufficient for at least routine maintenance and minor repairs.
BurningFrog 7y ago
My cynical read is that the bike rider/repair lobby was one of the groups at the table, and this is what they managed to get.

aplummer 7y ago

If you’re right that money in a public health system will pay back dividends I imagine.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

duxup 7y ago

Is anyone really waiting for €50 to use or not use their bike on a regular basis? I'm highly skeptical. This seems like it will just benefit folks already doing it anyway.

jxcl 7y ago
Maybe not, but a properly tuned and lubricated bike is waaaayyyyy more pleasant to ride and may help to encourage increased bike use. It's easier to do stuff when it's pleasant.
doyoureallytnot 7y ago
I really think so. We had a pop-up bike repair workshop come around every month at my last place of work and it really increased bike use in the area.
ploika 7y ago
Absolutely. There are plenty of people who have a bike with a flat tyre and a rusty chain and no lights or whatever. They might go back to taking the bus or metro, but if they were offered a free service (effectively) to make cycling a viable option, they'll take it. I know loads of people who cycle to work because of Ireland's Bike To Work scheme. They can all afford a bike without help, but the extra incentive was enough to get them to start cycling.
- wolco 7y ago
  Would they go through all of that in the hopes of getting upto $50.00?
  - fluffything 7y ago
    Through all of what? Walking your bike 200m to the closest bike shop? With 50 EUR, every bike shop does the usual tear fixes: changing tubes, adjusting gears and brake levers, changing break pads, changing the handlebar tape, centering the wheels, and cleaning / oiling. Those 50 EUR can't cover major damage, but lots of people in Europe have multiple bikes in their basement that are just "rusty" / flat tire / etc. and that they didn't needed during the winter.
    - Y-bar 7y ago
      > Walking your bike 200m to the closest bike shop? This also illustrates a secondary benefit of these €50, namely that bike repairs are hyper-local. In addition to making bike repair more affordable for some and helping keep the momentum going on bike commuting, these euros can also drive more commerce to local small repair shops, helping them stay in business.
  - adambard 7y ago
    On July 11, 7-11 offers a free slurpee to all customers. The free slurpee cup is a fraction of the size of any of the already-very-cheap options available for sale. I have seen lineups out the door and around the block on this occasion. I think this illustrates very well people's well-known tendency to irrationally value free stuff.
  - zxexz 7y ago
    I would. I also want to point out that you seem to be trivializing what most people would consider a non-trivial amount of money. That's easily a month of groceries for one person.
    - smeyer 7y ago

doyoureallytnot 7y ago

I think this is exactly it. A lot of people have bikes already but they're a little run down and this might be the encouragement they need to get them fixed. The fact is that most people can't do even the simplest repairs on their own bike and if their bike is run down then they're less likely to use it.

ogre_codes 7y ago

Bikes tend to degrade slowly over time if you don't do regular maintenance. Most people don't notice the slow decline until it's quite bad when suddenly it feels like an unreliable POS. Giving people who are just a little frustrated with their bike might go a long way to helping keep people from getting to that point at least once.

cultus 7y ago
This doesn't get enough attention in cycling promotion. One of the absolute biggest reasons that people aren't on their bikes is maintenance. Wheels go out of true, shifting gets wonky, and it starts to look like an unreliable form of transport. Sturdier commuter bikes help a lot with this, but every commuter seems to think they need a bike with super-light wheels and a thin, weak 12-speed chain.
- ogre_codes 7y ago
  One of the reasons I think people like the bike share programs. The bikes are burly and slow, but they get the maintenance they need where they usually don't end up truly horrible.
  - dmoy 7y ago
    I guess this depends on the bike share program. I've definitely ridden my share of bike share bikes that were in very bad shape (and I have a fairly high tolerance for junkers). The bike share program in question shut down and isn't available in my area anymore, so maybe that was just because they were cutting back.
    - dmurray 7y ago
      The docked bikes in my city have way better build quality and maintenance standards than the undocked ones. They're both heavy but the undocked ones have chains falling off, broken shifters, etc. I expect it makes sense that these get less investment as they are easier to steal.
  - 7y ago

Noos 7y ago

"keeping cycling going" is much less important than spending that money to deal with job loss and unemployment. This is using a crisis to divert money to a person's pet agendas. if you want to subsidize cycling and stuff, can we at least get the economy back up first and deal with the massive fallout from lost wages due to time off, and business closings?

ploika 7y ago
Where I live, cycling is much cheaper than public transport and astronomically cheaper than driving. If you have lost wages and still have to go places, that's important. You're assuming that there's a choice between supporting an economic recovery and supporting cycling. I don't believe there is, certainly not when it comes to return on investment for €50 per person. I see increased mobility, decreased congestion in towns and cities, less pollution and less income lost to transport costs, not to mention the health benefits from more exercise.
icebraining 7y ago
I don't see a "than" here. These vouchers are also a cash injection into French businesses and workers, and specifically ones who are both important from a policy standpoint and yet likely to get heavily beaten by the crisis, since everyone delays repairs in a crisis.

analog31 7y ago

50 bucks is more than most of my bikes are worth. ;-) But seriously I think that most bikes are within 50 bucks of being rideable. I tinker with a lot of old bikes, for family, friends, and at one time for a charity program. At least in the US, a huge fraction of bikes are gathering dust or rust, but the tires are flat, there's no pump in the house, some of the mechanisms are stuck, they haven't been properly adjusted for comfort, etc. Many of the bikes weren't properly built in the first place, and need attention to things like spoke tension and bearing adjustment. And the owners aren't handy with tools. A bit of lube, air in the tires, and maybe a reassurance from the mechanic at a shop, and some accessories such as a pump, will have the bike up and running. At the very least it will help the shops stay afloat. If the subsidy kicks in all at once for a lot of people, it could trigger a noticeable increase in bike use, which has a crowd psychology benefit. For everybody, my consistent advice is that your experience with any kind of cycling will be greatly improved by becoming self sufficient for at least routine maintenance and minor repairs.

BurningFrog 7y ago

My cynical read is that the bike rider/repair lobby was one of the groups at the table, and this is what they managed to get.