3 ms·

I'm no expert but it seems like we keep subsidizing both coal mining & coal burning, as well as creating legal obstacles for better energy technology, for the s

I'm no expert but it seems like we keep subsidizing both coal mining & coal burning, as well as creating legal obstacles for better energy technology, for the sake of propping up an industry with a lot of jobs. I feel like, lately, there's been a big effort to keep these things going in spite of greener energy options being more and more affordable just so we don't put a lot of people out of work.

marzell 6y ago
Yea I think it's part status quo (from a narrow perspective) and also an example of, "if all you have is a hammer, everything is a nail." For people involved in the energy sector, but only really know coal, the only way they can comprehend maintaining and expanding business is to maintain and expand coal operations. The industry may pivot, but the dinosaurs (har har) of coal will often just maintain their current course until they become extinct (har har again).
- mistermann 6y ago
  > if all you have is a hammer, everything is a nail. This is a very old and popular meme. But as an "armchair epistemologist", who also happens to be growing rather weary of endless armchair economic and political critics "telling it like it is", whenever I encounter memes like this, my first question is always: "To what degree is this meme actually true?" It seems like not just a fair question, but an important one. > For people involved in the energy sector, but only really know coal, the only way they can comprehend maintaining and expanding business is to maintain and expand coal operations. "the [only way] [they] [can comprehend]" seems like a rather extraordinary claim (and you know what "they" say about extraordinary claim), that would require rather intimate knowledge of the thoughts of of multiple people. I'm curious, how did you come to possess this knowledge? By what mechanism?
jhallenworld 6y ago
There are not even that many jobs. How many people do you think it takes to run a strip mine? Take a look: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/23/Liebherr_T282C_Coal_Haul_Truck.png/1280px-Liebherr_T282C_Coal_Haul_Truck.png https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/23/Li... https://earthfirstnews.files.wordpress.com/2013/08/narm_aerial_1203.jpg https://earthfirstnews.files.wordpress.com/2013/08/narm_aeri... It turns out that the biggest competition for coal jobs is more efficient coal mines- in this case the strip mines of the Powder River Basin. It's all the more astounding that solar is cheaper than coal.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
Frondo 6y ago
There aren't really that many coal jobs, big-picture-wise, about 60,000. Arby's employs more people than that.
- azinman2 6y ago
  They make a lot more than Arby’s employees. They’re also the main economic engine of some areas.
  - kjs3 6y ago
    And like all single-source "main economic engines", it's only a matter of time before their demise destroys their local economy.
mistermann 6y ago
I don't know much about it, what kind of initiatives and dollars are we talking about here for subsidies?

marzell 6y ago

Yea I think it's part status quo (from a narrow perspective) and also an example of, "if all you have is a hammer, everything is a nail." For people involved in the energy sector, but only really know coal, the only way they can comprehend maintaining and expanding business is to maintain and expand coal operations. The industry may pivot, but the dinosaurs (har har) of coal will often just maintain their current course until they become extinct (har har again).

mistermann 6y ago
> if all you have is a hammer, everything is a nail. This is a very old and popular meme. But as an "armchair epistemologist", who also happens to be growing rather weary of endless armchair economic and political critics "telling it like it is", whenever I encounter memes like this, my first question is always: "To what degree is this meme actually true?" It seems like not just a fair question, but an important one. > For people involved in the energy sector, but only really know coal, the only way they can comprehend maintaining and expanding business is to maintain and expand coal operations. "the [only way] [they] [can comprehend]" seems like a rather extraordinary claim (and you know what "they" say about extraordinary claim), that would require rather intimate knowledge of the thoughts of of multiple people. I'm curious, how did you come to possess this knowledge? By what mechanism?

jhallenworld 6y ago

There are not even that many jobs. How many people do you think it takes to run a strip mine? Take a look: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/23/Liebherr_T282C_Coal_Haul_Truck.png/1280px-Liebherr_T282C_Coal_Haul_Truck.png https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/23/Li... https://earthfirstnews.files.wordpress.com/2013/08/narm_aerial_1203.jpg https://earthfirstnews.files.wordpress.com/2013/08/narm_aeri... It turns out that the biggest competition for coal jobs is more efficient coal mines- in this case the strip mines of the Powder River Basin. It's all the more astounding that solar is cheaper than coal.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

Frondo 6y ago

There aren't really that many coal jobs, big-picture-wise, about 60,000. Arby's employs more people than that.

azinman2 6y ago
They make a lot more than Arby’s employees. They’re also the main economic engine of some areas.
- kjs3 6y ago
  And like all single-source "main economic engines", it's only a matter of time before their demise destroys their local economy.

mistermann 6y ago

I don't know much about it, what kind of initiatives and dollars are we talking about here for subsidies?