4 ms·

Interesting, I can only wish to run this sort of tech for my own small company.

yongjik 6y ago
I think you shouldn't - it's like wishing you could drive an 18-wheeler to do grocery. Most people don't need that kind of firepower ever, and that's a good thing - where are you going to park your 18-wheeler, for starters?
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
jmalicki 6y ago
Can't you run Kubernetes? (which is the open-source project from Google inspired by Borg)
- twblalock 6y ago
  Kubernetes is very different from Borg.
  - tra3 6y ago
    Can you share how? I’ve heard of borg previously as a inspiration for open source k8s but I’m surprised to hear that it’s very different.
    - GauntletWizard 6y ago
      As a former Google SRE: Kubernetes is very different for Borg, but it's also not. Most of the core concepts apply (A Borg "Alloc" is a Kubernetes "Pod", a "Task" in an alloc is a "Container" inside a pod, they're often implemented very differently but the abstraction can be reasoned about in much the same ways. However, the developer experience is hugely different, both in the things that Kubernetes does have (Configuration Canaries) and the things it doesn't have (Global Load Balancing). There's patterns and hacks around most of these, but they're often created by developers who didn't understand the tradeoffs. Most importantly: Borg is very well sanded. Borg was a production-ready system ten years ago, and while it's had to grow and change, there's many things that "work together" just nicely in the Google Ecosystem, that just don't yet outside. Partially because they support many more alternative implementations that don't quite have a standard API, but mostly because there's just rough spots about how you deal with marginal/edge cases that aren't found and documentation written on how to avoid them.
  - justicezyx 6y ago
    It's still an inspiration. K8s was meant to fix borg's broken application management semantics and toolings.
GauntletWizard 6y ago
You can! I have all the equivalent graphs and most of the equivalent features on the k8s clusters I run. Google has commoditized borg, at least for the scales that most companies will run.
- justicezyx 6y ago
  Not really, Borg is itself only at the scale it operates at. It's like Michael Jordan is not the baseball god, if it's only allowed to playing with 5 year old kiddos.
  - GauntletWizard 6y ago
    Some scale is needed to see the true awesomeness of Borg, and you can't built a K8s cluster anywhere near as big as a Borg cell, but many of the same "Cool features" can be built on K8s as well as they can with borg. Things like rolling deploys and stateless, self-healing systems work at k8s scale. I recently got back on a project that was on maintenance mode for a year - But because it had a nice K8s setup, it had more or less managed itself through OS upgrades and rebuilds with very little user intervention.

I think you shouldn't - it's like wishing you could drive an 18-wheeler to do grocery. Most people don't need that kind of firepower ever, and that's a good thing - where are you going to park your 18-wheeler, for starters?

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

jmalicki 6y ago

Can't you run Kubernetes? (which is the open-source project from Google inspired by Borg)

twblalock 6y ago
Kubernetes is very different from Borg.
- tra3 6y ago
  Can you share how? I’ve heard of borg previously as a inspiration for open source k8s but I’m surprised to hear that it’s very different.
  - GauntletWizard 6y ago
    As a former Google SRE: Kubernetes is very different for Borg, but it's also not. Most of the core concepts apply (A Borg "Alloc" is a Kubernetes "Pod", a "Task" in an alloc is a "Container" inside a pod, they're often implemented very differently but the abstraction can be reasoned about in much the same ways. However, the developer experience is hugely different, both in the things that Kubernetes does have (Configuration Canaries) and the things it doesn't have (Global Load Balancing). There's patterns and hacks around most of these, but they're often created by developers who didn't understand the tradeoffs. Most importantly: Borg is very well sanded. Borg was a production-ready system ten years ago, and while it's had to grow and change, there's many things that "work together" just nicely in the Google Ecosystem, that just don't yet outside. Partially because they support many more alternative implementations that don't quite have a standard API, but mostly because there's just rough spots about how you deal with marginal/edge cases that aren't found and documentation written on how to avoid them.
- justicezyx 6y ago
  It's still an inspiration. K8s was meant to fix borg's broken application management semantics and toolings.

GauntletWizard 6y ago

You can! I have all the equivalent graphs and most of the equivalent features on the k8s clusters I run. Google has commoditized borg, at least for the scales that most companies will run.

justicezyx 6y ago
Not really, Borg is itself only at the scale it operates at. It's like Michael Jordan is not the baseball god, if it's only allowed to playing with 5 year old kiddos.
- GauntletWizard 6y ago
  Some scale is needed to see the true awesomeness of Borg, and you can't built a K8s cluster anywhere near as big as a Borg cell, but many of the same "Cool features" can be built on K8s as well as they can with borg. Things like rolling deploys and stateless, self-healing systems work at k8s scale. I recently got back on a project that was on maintenance mode for a year - But because it had a nice K8s setup, it had more or less managed itself through OS upgrades and rebuilds with very little user intervention.