6 ms·

When you have to hire a professional, for example a plumber, do you put out an ad and say "I need to hire a plumber to fix a broken pipe by running a new sewer

When you have to hire a professional, for example a plumber, do you put out an ad and say "I need to hire a plumber to fix a broken pipe by running a new sewer line out to the street, and the job pays $60.00 per hour". Or do you call around, describe your problem, and see what solutions and cost various plumbers can provide? Basically, "Here's my problem, what is the fix, and how much will it cost?"

gregd 6y ago
What in the world does this have to do with hiring an employee with salary? Hiring a plumber on a per job basis isn't the same thing at all and getting bids for jobs like this, works. Do you seriously think that people should bid to fill positions at companies?
- matz1 6y ago
  How is it different ? From the perspective of the companies, it is in their interest for the prospective employee to bid to fill position.
  - derekp7 6y ago
    Also, a good approach from the employee side is to explain during the interview what all they can do for the company. That's the approach I took last time around, I got in the mindset that I was a consultant that was there to solve their problems, and this is how. Got the job offer an hour later. Kind of like a plumber saying "We don't need to dig up your front yard and charge 9 grand, for 500 bucks we can robotically patch the pipe from the inside".
  - gregd 6y ago
    I see. So we should start listing benefits to doing our job for a plumber? "Hey there Plumber, if you do this job, I'll give you health insurance for the two days it takes you to do this job. I'll provide a gym membership, free coffee, and pay your taxes"
    - matz1 6y ago
      Its called analogy, not everything has to be the same. In the case of plumber, the benefits for plumber to take the job is they get to make money.
      - gregd 6y ago
        I'm saying the analogy in this case, doesn't work. Hiring a plumber, carpenter, electrician on a per job basis is not the same as hiring an employee (hopefully for a long-term commitment).
        matz1 6y ago
        We are specifically talking about the case of hiding salary right ? How is it different ?
        palerdot 6y ago
        It is different that plumbing/carpenting et al are one time gigs. They just walk away collecting their money once they put in their fixed hours. You will not be able to call your plumber at midnight if you feel like some thing that needs to be fixed. Your analogy might work for short term contractors but not for a full time employment, where essentially you are putting yourself at your employers service virtually 24/7 with almost no extra pay while doing intangible (aka knowledge) work where the employer might get 5x or 200x return out of your work, but essentially you will just get almost linear pay raises (even including performance bonuses). You cannot compare a full time knowledge worker with a gig worker that does tangible physical work.
        mamon 6y ago
        Plumber's job with a single customer usually lasts one or two days, so the plumber's income is not dependent on any single customer. They might be willing to risk it and take a job without a price set beforehand, because the worst case scenario they lose, say, a single day pay.
pravda 6y ago
>the job pays $60.00 per hour That's probably the best strategy. It removes the problem the plumber has when quoting a price, which is "how much can I soak this guy for?"
sas1ni69 6y ago
It's more like. Looking for a plumber. Can only pay 10% more over your last pay, doesn't matter if it's below market rate.
mgkimsal 6y ago
sure, but typically you're not 'hiring' in the traditional sense, and the 'problem' may only be a few hours or days. The "problem" at many companies is "we need someone to be able to continually identify and respond to a range of problems as they come up over the next 1-4 years".
- notahacker 6y ago
  Which makes putting an annual figure for candidates who all might be useful at solving some of the company's problems but not necessarily the same ones to the same extent even less of a logical starting point... There are loads of jobs that post exactly how much they're willing to pay, it's just that they're the ones which consider workers with the minimum level of experience to be a cheap, undifferentiated commodity they won't in any circumstances pay more than the fixed rate, and the rates tend to be in the $12 per hour range
SketchySeaBeast 6y ago
Plumbers will have publicly available shop rates so they can compare to eachother. Every dev doesn't.

gregd 6y ago

What in the world does this have to do with hiring an employee with salary? Hiring a plumber on a per job basis isn't the same thing at all and getting bids for jobs like this, works. Do you seriously think that people should bid to fill positions at companies?

matz1 6y ago
How is it different ? From the perspective of the companies, it is in their interest for the prospective employee to bid to fill position.
- derekp7 6y ago
  Also, a good approach from the employee side is to explain during the interview what all they can do for the company. That's the approach I took last time around, I got in the mindset that I was a consultant that was there to solve their problems, and this is how. Got the job offer an hour later. Kind of like a plumber saying "We don't need to dig up your front yard and charge 9 grand, for 500 bucks we can robotically patch the pipe from the inside".
- gregd 6y ago
  I see. So we should start listing benefits to doing our job for a plumber? "Hey there Plumber, if you do this job, I'll give you health insurance for the two days it takes you to do this job. I'll provide a gym membership, free coffee, and pay your taxes"
  - matz1 6y ago
    Its called analogy, not everything has to be the same. In the case of plumber, the benefits for plumber to take the job is they get to make money.
    - gregd 6y ago
      I'm saying the analogy in this case, doesn't work. Hiring a plumber, carpenter, electrician on a per job basis is not the same as hiring an employee (hopefully for a long-term commitment).
      - matz1 6y ago
        We are specifically talking about the case of hiding salary right ? How is it different ?
        palerdot 6y ago
        It is different that plumbing/carpenting et al are one time gigs. They just walk away collecting their money once they put in their fixed hours. You will not be able to call your plumber at midnight if you feel like some thing that needs to be fixed. Your analogy might work for short term contractors but not for a full time employment, where essentially you are putting yourself at your employers service virtually 24/7 with almost no extra pay while doing intangible (aka knowledge) work where the employer might get 5x or 200x return out of your work, but essentially you will just get almost linear pay raises (even including performance bonuses). You cannot compare a full time knowledge worker with a gig worker that does tangible physical work.
        mamon 6y ago
        Plumber's job with a single customer usually lasts one or two days, so the plumber's income is not dependent on any single customer. They might be willing to risk it and take a job without a price set beforehand, because the worst case scenario they lose, say, a single day pay.

pravda 6y ago

>the job pays $60.00 per hour That's probably the best strategy. It removes the problem the plumber has when quoting a price, which is "how much can I soak this guy for?"

sas1ni69 6y ago

It's more like. Looking for a plumber. Can only pay 10% more over your last pay, doesn't matter if it's below market rate.

mgkimsal 6y ago

sure, but typically you're not 'hiring' in the traditional sense, and the 'problem' may only be a few hours or days. The "problem" at many companies is "we need someone to be able to continually identify and respond to a range of problems as they come up over the next 1-4 years".

notahacker 6y ago
Which makes putting an annual figure for candidates who all might be useful at solving some of the company's problems but not necessarily the same ones to the same extent even less of a logical starting point... There are loads of jobs that post exactly how much they're willing to pay, it's just that they're the ones which consider workers with the minimum level of experience to be a cheap, undifferentiated commodity they won't in any circumstances pay more than the fixed rate, and the rates tend to be in the $12 per hour range

SketchySeaBeast 6y ago

Plumbers will have publicly available shop rates so they can compare to eachother. Every dev doesn't.