3 ms·

I can't help but recall that the Great Depression and the resulting widespread poverty is considered by some historians to be one of the factors leading up WW2.

tamaharbor 7y ago
A good war can always be used to revive the economy.
eloff 7y ago
I would say the suffering, hyper-inflation and widespread poverty imposed on Germany by the allies after World War I was a stronger proximate cause for the rise of the Nazis and the war in Europe. A very depressing illustration of the proverb that you reap what you sow. WWI was a complex jostling for power of the kind that had always happened in Europe, but on a scale and devastation never before seen. If not sparked by the assassination of Archduke Ferdinand, it would have likely been sparked by something else. WWII, on the other hand, was probably entirely avoidable, if not for the Treaty of Versailles. At least in Europe.
- axguscbklp 7y ago
  Not sure about that. From what I understand, the German economy was recovering nicely and the Nazis were doing poorly in elections in the late 1920s. Then the Great Depression hit. Nazi share of the vote in German federal elections from 1924 to the Nazi seizure of power in 1933: May 1924 - 6.5% Dec 1924 - 3.0% May 1928 - 2.6% Sep 1930 - 18.25% Jul 1932 - 37.27% Nov 1932 - 33.09%
  - redis_mlc 7y ago
    I study WW2, so I'll delay my detailed comment and give a chance for somebody else to provide context for those stats. Hint: There's lies, damned lies and statistics.
  - marcusverus 7y ago
    The Great Depression began with the crash of the American stock market in September of '29[0]. Your stats sure make it look like that was a major tipping point for support for the Nazis. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Depression https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Depression
  - unhomedcoder 7y ago
    unemploymemt in Weimar 1932 was 30%. umemploymemt in the Reich in 1936 was 1%. like some wise economist said "it's the economy, stupid." i hear today US unemployment is 30+% and will hit 45% by July. i guess if America was ever going to repeat the steps from Weimar to Reich, that time is now. what was Hitler's formula for his economic miracle? it was dead simple. 1. default on the War Debt (owed to America) 2. pour over 50% of GDP in the re-armament in preparation to go to War. America is -$27 trillion in debt now. if we start ramping up the war machine to test drive the eagle against, oh, say, Chy-na, then start to worry about the new Weimar to Reich tramsition. may you live in interesting times.
  - eloff 7y ago
    Wow, that's pretty marked. I think there could be something to that theory then. I'd like to see more context around that before I'm convinced though.
- gremlinsinc 7y ago
  Sounds like how we're treating IRAN/Cuba/others w/ sanctions during a pandemic. I guess we'll reap what we sow again if we keep it up. Seems when you do bad things it comes back to bites you in the ass.
segmondy 7y ago
If you wanna go that route, then actually, the Spanish flu is what led to the WW2. ;-) US President Woodrom Wilson cam down with flu, had a stroke and early retirement from public life. So he couldn't persuade US govt to join the newly formed League of Nations or ratify the Treaty of Versailles. He didn't support punitive measure against German state. Since US was no longer part of process, German paid hard. Hyper inflation took hold, 4marks to a dollar ended up 4 billion marks for a dollar. That hardship and resentment is the environment the fueled Hitler and brought him support. Interesting reading, "The Spanish Flu epidemic and it's influence on history"
- unhomedcoder 7y ago
  i bet Hitler never once forgot about the period of time between 1911-1915 when he was impoverished, unemployable and homeless. it's funny how a cruel and exploitive economy tends to backfire when the one wrong guy is crushed by it, and then dedicates his life to overthrowing that economy.

tamaharbor 7y ago

A good war can always be used to revive the economy.

eloff 7y ago

I would say the suffering, hyper-inflation and widespread poverty imposed on Germany by the allies after World War I was a stronger proximate cause for the rise of the Nazis and the war in Europe. A very depressing illustration of the proverb that you reap what you sow. WWI was a complex jostling for power of the kind that had always happened in Europe, but on a scale and devastation never before seen. If not sparked by the assassination of Archduke Ferdinand, it would have likely been sparked by something else. WWII, on the other hand, was probably entirely avoidable, if not for the Treaty of Versailles. At least in Europe.

axguscbklp 7y ago
Not sure about that. From what I understand, the German economy was recovering nicely and the Nazis were doing poorly in elections in the late 1920s. Then the Great Depression hit. Nazi share of the vote in German federal elections from 1924 to the Nazi seizure of power in 1933: May 1924 - 6.5% Dec 1924 - 3.0% May 1928 - 2.6% Sep 1930 - 18.25% Jul 1932 - 37.27% Nov 1932 - 33.09%
- redis_mlc 7y ago
  I study WW2, so I'll delay my detailed comment and give a chance for somebody else to provide context for those stats. Hint: There's lies, damned lies and statistics.
- marcusverus 7y ago
  The Great Depression began with the crash of the American stock market in September of '29[0]. Your stats sure make it look like that was a major tipping point for support for the Nazis. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Depression https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Depression
- unhomedcoder 7y ago
  unemploymemt in Weimar 1932 was 30%. umemploymemt in the Reich in 1936 was 1%. like some wise economist said "it's the economy, stupid." i hear today US unemployment is 30+% and will hit 45% by July. i guess if America was ever going to repeat the steps from Weimar to Reich, that time is now. what was Hitler's formula for his economic miracle? it was dead simple. 1. default on the War Debt (owed to America) 2. pour over 50% of GDP in the re-armament in preparation to go to War. America is -$27 trillion in debt now. if we start ramping up the war machine to test drive the eagle against, oh, say, Chy-na, then start to worry about the new Weimar to Reich tramsition. may you live in interesting times.
- eloff 7y ago
  Wow, that's pretty marked. I think there could be something to that theory then. I'd like to see more context around that before I'm convinced though.
gremlinsinc 7y ago
Sounds like how we're treating IRAN/Cuba/others w/ sanctions during a pandemic. I guess we'll reap what we sow again if we keep it up. Seems when you do bad things it comes back to bites you in the ass.

segmondy 7y ago

If you wanna go that route, then actually, the Spanish flu is what led to the WW2. ;-) US President Woodrom Wilson cam down with flu, had a stroke and early retirement from public life. So he couldn't persuade US govt to join the newly formed League of Nations or ratify the Treaty of Versailles. He didn't support punitive measure against German state. Since US was no longer part of process, German paid hard. Hyper inflation took hold, 4marks to a dollar ended up 4 billion marks for a dollar. That hardship and resentment is the environment the fueled Hitler and brought him support. Interesting reading, "The Spanish Flu epidemic and it's influence on history"

unhomedcoder 7y ago
i bet Hitler never once forgot about the period of time between 1911-1915 when he was impoverished, unemployable and homeless. it's funny how a cruel and exploitive economy tends to backfire when the one wrong guy is crushed by it, and then dedicates his life to overthrowing that economy.