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Data can be fake or manipulated though. And in the case of covid-19, a lot of the data is highly questionable. "The figures are questionable Angelo Borrelli, t

Data can be fake or manipulated though. And in the case of covid-19, a lot of the data is highly questionable. "The figures are questionable Angelo Borrelli, the head of Civil Protection, who announces the latest figures every day at 6 p.m., said Saturday night that the 793 new deaths have been caused “by and with” the coronavirus. “We count all the dead, we make no distinction between with and by the coronavirus.” However, one wonders whether these daily figures reflect the situation correctly. The dead are said to have almost all had one or more other diseases, which leaves a question mark as to exactly how deadly the coronavirus is. At the same time, it has become clear that a large number of people who die at home (which is often a retirement home) do not undergo a coronavirus test." https://www.nrc.nl/nieuws/2020/03/22/als-italie-het-voorland-is-wat-staat-nederland-te-wachten-a3994528 https://www.nrc.nl/nieuws/2020/03/22/als-italie-het-voorland...

hannasanarion 6y ago
That paragraph is questioning the conclusion: how deadly the virus is, not the data: how many people died and how. Seeking an alternate explanation for the data, which is what scientists do, is not the same as denying the data, which is what zealots do.
- drummer 6y ago
  It also questions the data, for example, the fact that even elderly dying at home without having been tested at all for COVID-19 (!!!) being counted as COVID-19 deaths. This is something I come across in more countries including the USA where various doctors have protested against policies that almost force them to include COVID-19 on death certificates. It's as if they want to artificially inflate the numbers to make COVID-19 seem a lot worse than it is. Watch this interview with Dr. Dan Erickson and Dr. Artin Massihi of Bakersfield, CA.: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmjYRJXKixY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmjYRJXKixY
snowwrestler 6y ago
While it is academically interesting to try to apportion blame between COVID-19 and underlying conditions, the basic fact on the ground is an anomalous rise in illnesses requiring critical care and resulting in death. This has been true since the first alarm bells in China, and has spread to other nations in a way that is easily observed first-hand, clearly reported by front-line medical staff, and consistent with the spread of a new disease. That obvious data is what populations and governments are reacting to, not some calculated IFR.

hannasanarion 6y ago

That paragraph is questioning the conclusion: how deadly the virus is, not the data: how many people died and how. Seeking an alternate explanation for the data, which is what scientists do, is not the same as denying the data, which is what zealots do.

drummer 6y ago
It also questions the data, for example, the fact that even elderly dying at home without having been tested at all for COVID-19 (!!!) being counted as COVID-19 deaths. This is something I come across in more countries including the USA where various doctors have protested against policies that almost force them to include COVID-19 on death certificates. It's as if they want to artificially inflate the numbers to make COVID-19 seem a lot worse than it is. Watch this interview with Dr. Dan Erickson and Dr. Artin Massihi of Bakersfield, CA.: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmjYRJXKixY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmjYRJXKixY

snowwrestler 6y ago

While it is academically interesting to try to apportion blame between COVID-19 and underlying conditions, the basic fact on the ground is an anomalous rise in illnesses requiring critical care and resulting in death. This has been true since the first alarm bells in China, and has spread to other nations in a way that is easily observed first-hand, clearly reported by front-line medical staff, and consistent with the spread of a new disease. That obvious data is what populations and governments are reacting to, not some calculated IFR.