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Somehow the idea that time is our only currency is conflated with efficiency. Yes, time is the most limited resources we have, and therefore the most precious,

Somehow the idea that time is our only currency is conflated with efficiency. Yes, time is the most limited resources we have, and therefore the most precious, but does this mean we have to squeeze every last bit of productivity from our time? Do we really have to keep running all the time, always optimising for more efficiency? I would say the exact opposite. If time is our most precious asset, let's rather spend it on what's really important: family, friends, community, environment, happiness, harmony. Let's pass our time doing things we love just the pleasure of doing it, rather than chasing after money, success of whatever. Let's live in the moment, for the moment.

keiferski 7y ago
I don’t think these are separate things at all. Being efficient with your work time is great because it lets you spend more time with family, friends, and so on. Long commutes are really the killer here: it’s super difficult to cook a family dinner if you get off work at 6:00, spend 30-60 minutes commuting home, 30 minutes buying groceries, another 30 minutes cooking, etc. Working from home and then cooking dinner with delivered groceries gives you an extra hour+ with your family.
- tluyben2 7y ago
  > Long commutes are really the killer here They are, but you are on HN so it's safe to assume you have other options, so why do you commute?
  - keiferski 7y ago
    I meant in general, for society. Personally I have a 10 minute bike commute to a private office because I prefer to have a little bit of space between work and home.
    - tluyben2 7y ago
      I think many people have that issue; they cannot actually stay at home doing what they want. It is a restricting factor actually creating the commuting issue you mention. Many people need to go to the office. I think it would be better to educate the kids to not have that mental hangup. Personally I never had that feeling (and never worked in an office for 25+ years; I am at my kitchen table and so is my wife); I was expecting to hear either of a) I have no other choice, because job/money b) I need space between work & home. Over the years I had business partners trying the same thing and getting divorced (like now with the virus; people simply cannot sit at home or endure their spouse and kids); maybe it wasn't too solid to begin with?
      - keiferski 7y ago
        > people simply cannot sit at home or endure their spouse and kids); maybe it wasn't too solid to begin with? Eh, I think this is a symptom of what I’ll call “Modern Excess Syndrome”: the idea that if unlimited amounts of something aren’t beneficial, then the thing itself is broken. I.e., if ‘more = better’ isn’t true for X, then X is undesirable or broken. It just illustrates the lack of nuance we have in contemporary western society. You see this play out in lots of ways. Helicopter parenting is a good example: the prevailing assumption is that a good parent is one who spends as much time and resources as humanly possibly with their kids. Yet as a consequence the children have worse outcomes, are less independent, etc. And people are less likely to become parents as they perceive parenthood as an end to their own life as individuals. The truth is: it is in the nature of some things to be focused, or sporadic, or limited in some way. Chocolate cake is a delicious treat, but eating it for every meal is both unhealthy and destroys much of its uniqueness.
        tluyben2 7y ago
        That could indeed be the case. I have, however, another explanation; most people just do stuff without thinking, planning or any forethought whatsoever just because 'it is normal'. You get married, you have kids, you buy a house, you get a job, you go to an office 9-5, you mingle with your colleagues (and you like it!) etc and everything else is weird or not for them. When confronted with major change, like this virus and as a result, working from home (getting laid off, health issues etc), they are forced from the path and realise that they do not like it. I 'zoom' with friends in my home country who have kids because 'it is something you do'; they love them when they see them 1-2 hours/day, but now they hate (big word, probably not true, but that's what they use, and not jokingly; they are getting burnt out) them, quite openly. They didn't think it through and that works because normally the kids are in school, sportclub, piano lessons, sleeping etc so you don't have to think too much. A big issue is that people are not taught and don't teach their kids to enjoy things without outside stimulants. If I have a computer that works (it can be, and actually I prefer, one from the 70s or 80s) and a manual, I can be alone for years. Now with internet it is even easier. But I was taught by my parents to enjoy myself with minimal 'stuff'; books, pen & paper and just my own thoughts. Many people seem to lack that resulting in decisions that are unwise and don't work long term.
RareSoft 7y ago
I agree in priciple but it's only by having money through success that we're able to enjoy those more meaningful aspects of life. The only group of people that have the luxury of prioritizing those more meaningful things are those with enough assets that they can do whatever they want. Everyone else has to try to keep up.

keiferski 7y ago

I don’t think these are separate things at all. Being efficient with your work time is great because it lets you spend more time with family, friends, and so on. Long commutes are really the killer here: it’s super difficult to cook a family dinner if you get off work at 6:00, spend 30-60 minutes commuting home, 30 minutes buying groceries, another 30 minutes cooking, etc. Working from home and then cooking dinner with delivered groceries gives you an extra hour+ with your family.

tluyben2 7y ago
> Long commutes are really the killer here They are, but you are on HN so it's safe to assume you have other options, so why do you commute?
- keiferski 7y ago
  I meant in general, for society. Personally I have a 10 minute bike commute to a private office because I prefer to have a little bit of space between work and home.
  - tluyben2 7y ago
    I think many people have that issue; they cannot actually stay at home doing what they want. It is a restricting factor actually creating the commuting issue you mention. Many people need to go to the office. I think it would be better to educate the kids to not have that mental hangup. Personally I never had that feeling (and never worked in an office for 25+ years; I am at my kitchen table and so is my wife); I was expecting to hear either of a) I have no other choice, because job/money b) I need space between work & home. Over the years I had business partners trying the same thing and getting divorced (like now with the virus; people simply cannot sit at home or endure their spouse and kids); maybe it wasn't too solid to begin with?
    - keiferski 7y ago
      > people simply cannot sit at home or endure their spouse and kids); maybe it wasn't too solid to begin with? Eh, I think this is a symptom of what I’ll call “Modern Excess Syndrome”: the idea that if unlimited amounts of something aren’t beneficial, then the thing itself is broken. I.e., if ‘more = better’ isn’t true for X, then X is undesirable or broken. It just illustrates the lack of nuance we have in contemporary western society. You see this play out in lots of ways. Helicopter parenting is a good example: the prevailing assumption is that a good parent is one who spends as much time and resources as humanly possibly with their kids. Yet as a consequence the children have worse outcomes, are less independent, etc. And people are less likely to become parents as they perceive parenthood as an end to their own life as individuals. The truth is: it is in the nature of some things to be focused, or sporadic, or limited in some way. Chocolate cake is a delicious treat, but eating it for every meal is both unhealthy and destroys much of its uniqueness.
      - tluyben2 7y ago
        That could indeed be the case. I have, however, another explanation; most people just do stuff without thinking, planning or any forethought whatsoever just because 'it is normal'. You get married, you have kids, you buy a house, you get a job, you go to an office 9-5, you mingle with your colleagues (and you like it!) etc and everything else is weird or not for them. When confronted with major change, like this virus and as a result, working from home (getting laid off, health issues etc), they are forced from the path and realise that they do not like it. I 'zoom' with friends in my home country who have kids because 'it is something you do'; they love them when they see them 1-2 hours/day, but now they hate (big word, probably not true, but that's what they use, and not jokingly; they are getting burnt out) them, quite openly. They didn't think it through and that works because normally the kids are in school, sportclub, piano lessons, sleeping etc so you don't have to think too much. A big issue is that people are not taught and don't teach their kids to enjoy things without outside stimulants. If I have a computer that works (it can be, and actually I prefer, one from the 70s or 80s) and a manual, I can be alone for years. Now with internet it is even easier. But I was taught by my parents to enjoy myself with minimal 'stuff'; books, pen & paper and just my own thoughts. Many people seem to lack that resulting in decisions that are unwise and don't work long term.

RareSoft 7y ago

I agree in priciple but it's only by having money through success that we're able to enjoy those more meaningful aspects of life. The only group of people that have the luxury of prioritizing those more meaningful things are those with enough assets that they can do whatever they want. Everyone else has to try to keep up.