10 ms·

The CIA’s human experiments with mind control (2017)

84 points by 1cvmask 7y ago

ganzuul 7y ago
Link redirects to a local front-page for me.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
ncmncm 7y ago
We really know only what they have chosen to let us know; and much of what we think we know is false. Getting people to believe falsehoods about the programs was a big part of them, and it worked way better that they had hoped. Jon Ronson's book Men Who Stare at Goats is a terrifying exploration of what these programs were really about. Make no mistake, these programs were prototypes for still-ongoing attacks on the American public.
- jariel 7y ago
  "these programs were prototypes for still-ongoing attacks on the American public." Needs evidence.
  - rmrfstar 7y ago
    One of many examples [1]. These tactics would be familiar to the Romans. They are as old as the hills. They are apparently common enough that HBGary proposed a collaboration with Palantir to use them against Glenn Greenwald [2]. [1] https://theintercept.com/2014/02/24/jtrig-manipulation/ https://theintercept.com/2014/02/24/jtrig-manipulation/ [2] https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20110209/22340513034/leaked-hbgary-documents-show-plan-to-spread-wikileaks-propaganda-bofa-attack-glenn-greenwald.shtml https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20110209/22340513034/leake...
    - jariel 7y ago
      These have absolutely nothing to do with said 'mind control' programs.
    - nl 7y ago
      These aren't mind control at all! Saying "the intelligence community is horrible" isn't the same as "these programs were prototypes for still-ongoing [mind control] attacks on the American public."
      - rmrfstar 7y ago
        We don't really know what took place in the "mind control" program, as the records were systematically destroyed [1]. One plausible interpretation is that these were mainly efforts in coercive control, rather than Hollywood style "mind control". We have extensive records of comparable efforts in East Germany [2], and it is reasonable to suspect that the American programs followed a similar thread of "research". Why wouldn't they? The tactics were apparently very successful. If you buy that argument, then the cited examples are logical successors. It is very easy to dismiss "mind control" programs as a weird vestige of a bygone era, but I think it is unlikely that institutions drew no durable lessons from them. [1] https://www.cia.gov/library/center-for-the-study-of-intelligence/kent-csi/vol44no4/html/v44i4a07p_0021.htm https://www.cia.gov/library/center-for-the-study-of-intellig... [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IWjzT2l5C34 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IWjzT2l5C34
        nl 7y ago
        The article was specifically about MK-Ultra style mind control. Saying there are other ways to try to get people to do what they want - especially at a population level as the OP claimed - is a completely different proposition. I've linked elsewhere to IARPA SHARP which is the closest thing to actual mind control. Do I think intelligence agencies try to manipulate public opinion by methods similar to advertising agencies? Yes absolutely! Do I think this this is mind control or anything resembling that? No, and I think it's important to note that despite all the leaks (Snowden, Wikileaks, etc etc) there is no hints that I'm wrong about this.
  - naringas 7y ago
    what makes you think they would have stopped?
  - fit2rule 7y ago
    Operation bluebird. MK ultra. Palantir. Keyscore. Have you not been paying attention?
    - nl 7y ago
      Only MK Ultra (which this article is about!) is anything resembling mind control. Apparently I'm paying more attention to what this is specifically about than you are!
      - fit2rule 7y ago
        Keyscore: social control. Palantir: social control. Bluebird: mind control at scale. I think you're being intentionally disingenuous. No sane person can look at those social control programs and think "well this is innocuous" or "compatible with the free and open society"...
        nl 7y ago
        I'm not being disingenuous at all. I'm arguing specifically that the statement "these [mind-control] programs were prototypes for still-ongoing [mind-control] attacks on the American public." Project Bluebird was in the 1950s which the article is about. You seem to be just pulling in all kinds of bad intelligence products. I'm not arguing that at all.
        fit2rule 7y ago
        These programs are related inasmuch as they revolve around controlling the American public mindset with regards to the military industrial complexes' illegal wars. CIA currently runs 1000+ black ops 'interrogation' sites around the world for the purpose of fulfilling the goals of these kinds of programs. The purpose is the justification of endless war and as we have seen, are quite effective at swaying American public opinion. cf., ISIS, et al,.
  - ncmncm 7y ago
    Surely you recall the US invading Iraq on the basis of fabricated evidence and an absolutely massive propaganda campaign? They harvested five trillion dollars off of that one stunt. Do you imagine they decided to quit while they were ahead?
    - nl 7y ago
      Did you read the article? Propaganda is not the same as the mind control they are talking about or the OP claimed is being used at the population level.
      - ncmncm 7y ago
        Propaganda was and is a big part of it. Lying about what was done is a big part of it. The Big Lie is that the program ended. Most people believe it, although not for any defensible reason.
- nl 7y ago
  > Men Who Stare at Goats is a terrifying exploration of what these programs were really about So an enormous waste of money that achieved nothing? > Make no mistake, these programs were prototypes for still-ongoing attacks on the American public. Take your conspiracy theories elsewhere.
  - Super_Jambo 7y ago
    The Snowdon leaks made it clear that US and UK security services are still happy to use psychological manipulation on their own public. Never mind that we already knew this since COINTELPRO.
    - flipcoder 7y ago
      What is worse: a nuclear weapon or a psychological weapon? Nuclear weapons sound more dangerous, but they cannot be used invisibly without triggering a catastrophic response, meaning their power is largely from the leverage they give to the owner. Psychological weapons can be hidden and used without detection, can be approved of by secret courts, and directly benefit governments in far more scenarios with far lower risk. They are also cheaper. So what is more dangerous to the public?
    - nl 7y ago
      Links, please. Specifically to the mind control, since that is what this is about. Psychological manipulation includes things like advertising and PR, so that isn't the same thing at all.
  - fit2rule 7y ago
    The use of the phrase "conspiracy theory" belies your ignorance. This term is too often effectively used against an inquisitive public, to shut down criticism of these agencies..
    - nl 7y ago
      Au contraire! I've studied conspiracy theories a lot! This is a great example: take something that did happen (experiments 40+ years ago), combine it with something more recent people know about in passing ("Men who state at goats" - which I'd note was exactly about how it didn't work at all), and then use it to project into the idea that it must be more advanced today and mysterious forces are using it. Indeed, the idea of taking something that did happen, and then weaving it into lots of other random things to hide it in the noise (like this comment does) is a tactic often used by intelligence operatives. There's a conspiracy theory for you to think about! I'd note that there is no evidence given at all. The OP could have spoken about the recent IARPA SHARP brain stimulation program[1] which is probably the most advanced research in this area. But clearly they didn't know about that or they'd also know how hard it is to make work and how far away from mind control it is! [1] https://www.iarpa.gov/index.php/research-programs/sharp https://www.iarpa.gov/index.php/research-programs/sharp
- fit2rule 7y ago
  We know a little bit that they didn't want us to know. The CIA wasn't as complete as possible with covering its tracks, and quite some independent research has been done on the remaining evidence. The trouble is the CIA and other nefarious intelligence agencies have worked very hard to discredit this, clearly because they committed crimes against humanity in their work. However there is still a healthy segment of society that are critical of these criminal agencies. There is still a lot more to be revealed.
baybal2 7y ago
Allen Dulles was a rare nutjob, it was only thanks to the chaos of interwar period he got such prominence
- fit2rule 7y ago
  Well, that and Operation Paperclip...
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
kace91 7y ago
Visiting the Stasi museum in Berlin is a nice eye opener for how subtle some intelligence work can be. You can see files describing acts like surrounding a specific person with potential dates that ghost him or "friends" that will treat him badly just to make the the person depressed and reduce their will to be politically active. Lots of what you see there would be considered delusions of a paranoid person if someone claimed to be the target of it nowadays. I'm convinced the only reason it stands out is that it's relatively weird to see a fallen government's intelligent files, since one that's still standing would never let you see them.
- albertTJames 7y ago
  it works too, I am so not active politically because of all those girls who ghosted me. I could have been a really big deal.
- exolymph 7y ago
  > Lots of what you see there would be considered delusions of a paranoid person if someone claimed to be the target of it nowadays. This is not a coincidence, making the target feel and/or look crazy is part of the technique.
- drummer 7y ago
  Are these files describing tactics of the Stasi also available online?
  - kace91 7y ago
    I found some interesting information available for free in a link from the museum's website. Check the "english publications" section at the bottom, the second link in particular is quite interesting: https://www.bstu.de/en/education/publications/ https://www.bstu.de/en/education/publications/
- stainforth 7y ago
  Oh definitely East German history makes it much easier to consume such information. But if conservative-run governments of the U.S. commit inhumane activities on their own people to neuter left movements seeking a more equitable society it's not such a bad result right?
Melting_Harps 7y ago
Did anyone catch the JRE podcast with Tom O'Neill [1], he was there detailing his findings and research on his book on Charles Manson and the Family and subsequently finding many of the associated links between Intelligence and Military agencies and personnel that were involved with MK ULTRA and other programs. Its quite the rabbit hole; I personally couldn't care less about the Manson family cult, as a kid I heard all about the scary hippy acid BS only to see them buying houses with their NIMBY tactics and driving gas guzzling SUVS in the 21st Century. Neither extremes turned out to be be true about those boomers, and instead all we got was a bland and trite form of entrenched entitlement in this country. However, being a proponent of psychedelic use for medicinal and therapeutic purposes for many current epidemics, I wanted to hear what he had to say. I ended up getting the audiobook, but haven't started it yet as I'm finishing a final project for one of my classes. But what was said so far on the podcast has been intriguing. Especially as the CIA released the redacted files in common limited hangout fashion, but what Tom did was go even deeper over the course of 20 YEARS and managed to get files that revealed how Graduate students, police and military men were used in a wide-spread network in clandestine operations to either conduct, observe, monitor the experiments of test subjects in their targeted studies/experiments or be experimented on in order to refine a technique to achieve a desired result. Its not clear to me if Manson and his crazy murders were intended to be used to solely discredit the psychedelic, anti-war or black movements of that period, but given what we saw with the Occupy Movement it is most definitely an effective tool in their arsenal to quell dissent that can be used if/when needed. Either way, the tarnished reputation of psychedelics and its legitimate psychologists/researchers has been a bane for Humanity but a successful boon for Big Pharma. So inexorably tying LSD to Manson makes sense if you want to outlaw a currently researched substance with positive clinical trials, especially when Tom's research reveals he may have been a subject himself as he had a series of unwarranted releases from arrest or jail and state appointed relationships with MK Ultra program operatives. I'm just MAPS has been able to reignite the legitimacy and utility of these class of drugs again after all these years. 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J36xPWBLcG8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J36xPWBLcG8
- justforyou 7y ago
  >> but given what we saw with the Occupy Movement Care to elaborate?
eth0up 7y ago
Something that should be, but isn't, essential high school curriculum: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unethical_human_experimentation_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unethical_human_experimentatio... I remember seeing the faces of incredulity on fellow (college) students during a presentation of this, that is, until they were challenged with compelling citation. Then things changed a bit. To relegate such activity to a permanent place in the past assumes a very hokey fundamental change in human nature, or, commits a very naive faith to regulation and transparency.
rdtsc 7y ago
> Though the MK-Ultra directors tried to convince the CIA’s independent audit board that the research should continue, the Inspector General insisted the agency follow new research ethics guidelines and bring all the programs on non-consenting volunteers to an end. I would like to believe that CIA collectively found their moral compass, learned their lesson, and that was just a dark page in its history. But given its history afterwards, say what they did in South America, the torture programs, etc., I just can't come to that conclusion. So assuming their morality stayed at about the same level as before. How could have they continued the programs if they wanted to? 1) Rename everything and not use MK-ULTRA label anymore. Find a way to transfer all the useful stuff to a new program and file it under a different label. Anyone looking for MK-ULTRA should not find anything if they went searching later. 2) Next, just like with torture programs, maybe migrate overseas?. Pay some brutal dictator somewhere, maybe blackmail him if there is any dirt on them, borrow some facilities, buy all the local police chiefs and so on. 3) Another avenue is contractors. There is a whole world of "contractors" which do all the dirty and illegal stuff the official intelligence agencies don't want to do. Give the programs some generic sounding names, outsource everything, and then through the back-channels tell the "researchers" what really to work on. Once results come in, file them as something else, compartmentalized so only a few people have access to them.
drummer 7y ago
Watch the documentary "State of mind" https://youtube.com/watch?v=g2sJPSzG4fw https://youtube.com/watch?v=g2sJPSzG4fw

84 points by 1cvmask 7y ago

ganzuul 7y ago

Link redirects to a local front-page for me.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

ncmncm 7y ago

We really know only what they have chosen to let us know; and much of what we think we know is false. Getting people to believe falsehoods about the programs was a big part of them, and it worked way better that they had hoped. Jon Ronson's book Men Who Stare at Goats is a terrifying exploration of what these programs were really about. Make no mistake, these programs were prototypes for still-ongoing attacks on the American public.

jariel 7y ago
"these programs were prototypes for still-ongoing attacks on the American public." Needs evidence.
- rmrfstar 7y ago
  One of many examples [1]. These tactics would be familiar to the Romans. They are as old as the hills. They are apparently common enough that HBGary proposed a collaboration with Palantir to use them against Glenn Greenwald [2]. [1] https://theintercept.com/2014/02/24/jtrig-manipulation/ https://theintercept.com/2014/02/24/jtrig-manipulation/ [2] https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20110209/22340513034/leaked-hbgary-documents-show-plan-to-spread-wikileaks-propaganda-bofa-attack-glenn-greenwald.shtml https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20110209/22340513034/leake...
  - jariel 7y ago
    These have absolutely nothing to do with said 'mind control' programs.
  - nl 7y ago
    These aren't mind control at all! Saying "the intelligence community is horrible" isn't the same as "these programs were prototypes for still-ongoing [mind control] attacks on the American public."
    - rmrfstar 7y ago
      We don't really know what took place in the "mind control" program, as the records were systematically destroyed [1]. One plausible interpretation is that these were mainly efforts in coercive control, rather than Hollywood style "mind control". We have extensive records of comparable efforts in East Germany [2], and it is reasonable to suspect that the American programs followed a similar thread of "research". Why wouldn't they? The tactics were apparently very successful. If you buy that argument, then the cited examples are logical successors. It is very easy to dismiss "mind control" programs as a weird vestige of a bygone era, but I think it is unlikely that institutions drew no durable lessons from them. [1] https://www.cia.gov/library/center-for-the-study-of-intelligence/kent-csi/vol44no4/html/v44i4a07p_0021.htm https://www.cia.gov/library/center-for-the-study-of-intellig... [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IWjzT2l5C34 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IWjzT2l5C34
      - nl 7y ago
        The article was specifically about MK-Ultra style mind control. Saying there are other ways to try to get people to do what they want - especially at a population level as the OP claimed - is a completely different proposition. I've linked elsewhere to IARPA SHARP which is the closest thing to actual mind control. Do I think intelligence agencies try to manipulate public opinion by methods similar to advertising agencies? Yes absolutely! Do I think this this is mind control or anything resembling that? No, and I think it's important to note that despite all the leaks (Snowden, Wikileaks, etc etc) there is no hints that I'm wrong about this.
- naringas 7y ago
  what makes you think they would have stopped?
- fit2rule 7y ago
  Operation bluebird. MK ultra. Palantir. Keyscore. Have you not been paying attention?
  - nl 7y ago
    Only MK Ultra (which this article is about!) is anything resembling mind control. Apparently I'm paying more attention to what this is specifically about than you are!
    - fit2rule 7y ago
      Keyscore: social control. Palantir: social control. Bluebird: mind control at scale. I think you're being intentionally disingenuous. No sane person can look at those social control programs and think "well this is innocuous" or "compatible with the free and open society"...
      - nl 7y ago
        I'm not being disingenuous at all. I'm arguing specifically that the statement "these [mind-control] programs were prototypes for still-ongoing [mind-control] attacks on the American public." Project Bluebird was in the 1950s which the article is about. You seem to be just pulling in all kinds of bad intelligence products. I'm not arguing that at all.
        fit2rule 7y ago
        These programs are related inasmuch as they revolve around controlling the American public mindset with regards to the military industrial complexes' illegal wars. CIA currently runs 1000+ black ops 'interrogation' sites around the world for the purpose of fulfilling the goals of these kinds of programs. The purpose is the justification of endless war and as we have seen, are quite effective at swaying American public opinion. cf., ISIS, et al,.
- ncmncm 7y ago
  Surely you recall the US invading Iraq on the basis of fabricated evidence and an absolutely massive propaganda campaign? They harvested five trillion dollars off of that one stunt. Do you imagine they decided to quit while they were ahead?
  - nl 7y ago
    Did you read the article? Propaganda is not the same as the mind control they are talking about or the OP claimed is being used at the population level.
    - ncmncm 7y ago
      Propaganda was and is a big part of it. Lying about what was done is a big part of it. The Big Lie is that the program ended. Most people believe it, although not for any defensible reason.
nl 7y ago
> Men Who Stare at Goats is a terrifying exploration of what these programs were really about So an enormous waste of money that achieved nothing? > Make no mistake, these programs were prototypes for still-ongoing attacks on the American public. Take your conspiracy theories elsewhere.
- Super_Jambo 7y ago
  The Snowdon leaks made it clear that US and UK security services are still happy to use psychological manipulation on their own public. Never mind that we already knew this since COINTELPRO.
  - flipcoder 7y ago
    What is worse: a nuclear weapon or a psychological weapon? Nuclear weapons sound more dangerous, but they cannot be used invisibly without triggering a catastrophic response, meaning their power is largely from the leverage they give to the owner. Psychological weapons can be hidden and used without detection, can be approved of by secret courts, and directly benefit governments in far more scenarios with far lower risk. They are also cheaper. So what is more dangerous to the public?
  - nl 7y ago
    Links, please. Specifically to the mind control, since that is what this is about. Psychological manipulation includes things like advertising and PR, so that isn't the same thing at all.
- fit2rule 7y ago
  The use of the phrase "conspiracy theory" belies your ignorance. This term is too often effectively used against an inquisitive public, to shut down criticism of these agencies..
  - nl 7y ago
    Au contraire! I've studied conspiracy theories a lot! This is a great example: take something that did happen (experiments 40+ years ago), combine it with something more recent people know about in passing ("Men who state at goats" - which I'd note was exactly about how it didn't work at all), and then use it to project into the idea that it must be more advanced today and mysterious forces are using it. Indeed, the idea of taking something that did happen, and then weaving it into lots of other random things to hide it in the noise (like this comment does) is a tactic often used by intelligence operatives. There's a conspiracy theory for you to think about! I'd note that there is no evidence given at all. The OP could have spoken about the recent IARPA SHARP brain stimulation program[1] which is probably the most advanced research in this area. But clearly they didn't know about that or they'd also know how hard it is to make work and how far away from mind control it is! [1] https://www.iarpa.gov/index.php/research-programs/sharp https://www.iarpa.gov/index.php/research-programs/sharp
fit2rule 7y ago
We know a little bit that they didn't want us to know. The CIA wasn't as complete as possible with covering its tracks, and quite some independent research has been done on the remaining evidence. The trouble is the CIA and other nefarious intelligence agencies have worked very hard to discredit this, clearly because they committed crimes against humanity in their work. However there is still a healthy segment of society that are critical of these criminal agencies. There is still a lot more to be revealed.

baybal2 7y ago

Allen Dulles was a rare nutjob, it was only thanks to the chaos of interwar period he got such prominence

fit2rule 7y ago
Well, that and Operation Paperclip...

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

kace91 7y ago

Visiting the Stasi museum in Berlin is a nice eye opener for how subtle some intelligence work can be. You can see files describing acts like surrounding a specific person with potential dates that ghost him or "friends" that will treat him badly just to make the the person depressed and reduce their will to be politically active. Lots of what you see there would be considered delusions of a paranoid person if someone claimed to be the target of it nowadays. I'm convinced the only reason it stands out is that it's relatively weird to see a fallen government's intelligent files, since one that's still standing would never let you see them.

albertTJames 7y ago
it works too, I am so not active politically because of all those girls who ghosted me. I could have been a really big deal.
exolymph 7y ago
> Lots of what you see there would be considered delusions of a paranoid person if someone claimed to be the target of it nowadays. This is not a coincidence, making the target feel and/or look crazy is part of the technique.
drummer 7y ago
Are these files describing tactics of the Stasi also available online?
- kace91 7y ago
  I found some interesting information available for free in a link from the museum's website. Check the "english publications" section at the bottom, the second link in particular is quite interesting: https://www.bstu.de/en/education/publications/ https://www.bstu.de/en/education/publications/
stainforth 7y ago
Oh definitely East German history makes it much easier to consume such information. But if conservative-run governments of the U.S. commit inhumane activities on their own people to neuter left movements seeking a more equitable society it's not such a bad result right?

Melting_Harps 7y ago

Did anyone catch the JRE podcast with Tom O'Neill [1], he was there detailing his findings and research on his book on Charles Manson and the Family and subsequently finding many of the associated links between Intelligence and Military agencies and personnel that were involved with MK ULTRA and other programs. Its quite the rabbit hole; I personally couldn't care less about the Manson family cult, as a kid I heard all about the scary hippy acid BS only to see them buying houses with their NIMBY tactics and driving gas guzzling SUVS in the 21st Century. Neither extremes turned out to be be true about those boomers, and instead all we got was a bland and trite form of entrenched entitlement in this country. However, being a proponent of psychedelic use for medicinal and therapeutic purposes for many current epidemics, I wanted to hear what he had to say. I ended up getting the audiobook, but haven't started it yet as I'm finishing a final project for one of my classes. But what was said so far on the podcast has been intriguing. Especially as the CIA released the redacted files in common limited hangout fashion, but what Tom did was go even deeper over the course of 20 YEARS and managed to get files that revealed how Graduate students, police and military men were used in a wide-spread network in clandestine operations to either conduct, observe, monitor the experiments of test subjects in their targeted studies/experiments or be experimented on in order to refine a technique to achieve a desired result. Its not clear to me if Manson and his crazy murders were intended to be used to solely discredit the psychedelic, anti-war or black movements of that period, but given what we saw with the Occupy Movement it is most definitely an effective tool in their arsenal to quell dissent that can be used if/when needed. Either way, the tarnished reputation of psychedelics and its legitimate psychologists/researchers has been a bane for Humanity but a successful boon for Big Pharma. So inexorably tying LSD to Manson makes sense if you want to outlaw a currently researched substance with positive clinical trials, especially when Tom's research reveals he may have been a subject himself as he had a series of unwarranted releases from arrest or jail and state appointed relationships with MK Ultra program operatives. I'm just MAPS has been able to reignite the legitimacy and utility of these class of drugs again after all these years. 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J36xPWBLcG8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J36xPWBLcG8

justforyou 7y ago
>> but given what we saw with the Occupy Movement Care to elaborate?

eth0up 7y ago

Something that should be, but isn't, essential high school curriculum: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unethical_human_experimentation_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unethical_human_experimentatio... I remember seeing the faces of incredulity on fellow (college) students during a presentation of this, that is, until they were challenged with compelling citation. Then things changed a bit. To relegate such activity to a permanent place in the past assumes a very hokey fundamental change in human nature, or, commits a very naive faith to regulation and transparency.

rdtsc 7y ago

> Though the MK-Ultra directors tried to convince the CIA’s independent audit board that the research should continue, the Inspector General insisted the agency follow new research ethics guidelines and bring all the programs on non-consenting volunteers to an end. I would like to believe that CIA collectively found their moral compass, learned their lesson, and that was just a dark page in its history. But given its history afterwards, say what they did in South America, the torture programs, etc., I just can't come to that conclusion. So assuming their morality stayed at about the same level as before. How could have they continued the programs if they wanted to? 1) Rename everything and not use MK-ULTRA label anymore. Find a way to transfer all the useful stuff to a new program and file it under a different label. Anyone looking for MK-ULTRA should not find anything if they went searching later. 2) Next, just like with torture programs, maybe migrate overseas?. Pay some brutal dictator somewhere, maybe blackmail him if there is any dirt on them, borrow some facilities, buy all the local police chiefs and so on. 3) Another avenue is contractors. There is a whole world of "contractors" which do all the dirty and illegal stuff the official intelligence agencies don't want to do. Give the programs some generic sounding names, outsource everything, and then through the back-channels tell the "researchers" what really to work on. Once results come in, file them as something else, compartmentalized so only a few people have access to them.

drummer 7y ago

Watch the documentary "State of mind" https://youtube.com/watch?v=g2sJPSzG4fw https://youtube.com/watch?v=g2sJPSzG4fw