5 ms·

The two big projects working on this are the Purism Librem 5 and the PinePhone, both run stock Linux with no binary blobs aside from an isolated cellular modem.

The two big projects working on this are the Purism Librem 5 and the PinePhone, both run stock Linux with no binary blobs aside from an isolated cellular modem. The Librem 5 has been delayed for years and the behaviour of the company is kind of sketchy, however going by Purism's videos the software is pretty good and getting better rapidly (and they upstream their changes back to Gnome). The PinePhone has shipped to some developers and the company has a history of actually making functional products, but the software is still a WIP, and Pine64's products are cheap (which is great for many people, but I would rather have a $400 phone than a <$150 phone, especially given that these ones won't suffer from software obsolescence). I can't wait for these things to become at least somewhat functional - I personally will be buying one as soon as they get phone calling, SMS, and a web browser (the Librem has them, and other Gnome applications, but it's still in preorder). Pinephone: https://www.pine64.org/pinephone/ https://www.pine64.org/pinephone/ - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21824962 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21824962 Librem 5: https://puri.sm/products/librem-5/ https://puri.sm/products/librem-5/ - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21369733 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21369733 - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21303770 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21303770 - https://puri.sm/posts/librem-5-vs-android-which-boots-faster/ https://puri.sm/posts/librem-5-vs-android-which-boots-faster... (stupid comparison vs a 6 year old Android phone - how out of touch is their marketing team and CEO to allow this to happen???)

hellcow 7y ago
That "stupid comparison" shows their phone booting in 13s. I just timed my Pixel 3 and it boots in the same time. That's really impressive any way you slice it.
- bscphil 7y ago
  Yes... but the comparison shows the Android phone taking over a minute. That's what makes it a stupid comparison. If they showed it side by side with your Pixel 3 it wouldn't look as impressive (or so thinks their marketing team).
sedatk 7y ago
13s boot time is still good regardless of the comparison phone.
benbristow 7y ago
These things look fun but if they don't get the app support they'll just go the same way that Firefox OS, Ubuntu Mobile and Windows Phone did. Unfortunately other than the hacker niche that's on this forum you won't get the average consumer using these devices/OSes and therefore you won't get the apps that attract people to use the devices in the first place.
- xvector 7y ago
  I think that as much as the community hates to hear it, these phones need to support sandboxed Android apps at near-native speed, or they're going nowhere fast.
- twicetwice 7y ago
  This is why I want Firefox to prioritize Progressive Web App support, and for PWAs to become more popular. Then an open device that can run Firefox can have access to a variety of apps that will work just the same as they would on an Android device. I understand there are drawbacks compared to native, but I really think they're worthwhile tradeoffs to enable new platforms to be immediately compatible with an existing set of cross-platform apps!
  - pjmlp 7y ago
    Except it is Google and Microsoft that are driving the show in regards to PWAs and their OS integration.
- nine_k 7y ago
  I heard FirefoxOS is doing well under a different brand? Does it have interesting apps, I wonder.
  - fstephany 7y ago
    It's KaiOS[1]. I think their biggest hit was the JioPhone in theIndian market[2] but the phone lineup is quite impressive for an alternative system. They've got some funding from Google[3] as well. [1]: https://www.kaiostech.com/ https://www.kaiostech.com/ [2]: https://www.financialexpress.com/industry/technology/reliances-jiophone-no-longer-top-selling-feature-phone-loses-spot-to-samsung/1745497/ https://www.financialexpress.com/industry/technology/relianc... [3]: https://www.theverge.com/2018/6/28/17513036/google-kaios-investment-feature-phones-firefox-os-apps-services-strategy https://www.theverge.com/2018/6/28/17513036/google-kaios-inv...
pabs3 7y ago
I expect there are more blobs than just the modem, for example the USB controller(s).
Iolaum 7y ago
RE: prices. Anecdotally I m happy with the ~$150 price tag. Those phones are not going to be daily drivers any time soon. I m much happier to buy a secondary phone for ~$150 than ~$400. I also suspect that a phone with hardware closer to a ~$400 android phone would be much harder to support with open source software/drivers.
pwdisswordfish2 7y ago
> the behaviour of the company is kind of sketchy Can you elaborate?

hellcow 7y ago

That "stupid comparison" shows their phone booting in 13s. I just timed my Pixel 3 and it boots in the same time. That's really impressive any way you slice it.

bscphil 7y ago
Yes... but the comparison shows the Android phone taking over a minute. That's what makes it a stupid comparison. If they showed it side by side with your Pixel 3 it wouldn't look as impressive (or so thinks their marketing team).

sedatk 7y ago

13s boot time is still good regardless of the comparison phone.

benbristow 7y ago

These things look fun but if they don't get the app support they'll just go the same way that Firefox OS, Ubuntu Mobile and Windows Phone did. Unfortunately other than the hacker niche that's on this forum you won't get the average consumer using these devices/OSes and therefore you won't get the apps that attract people to use the devices in the first place.

xvector 7y ago
I think that as much as the community hates to hear it, these phones need to support sandboxed Android apps at near-native speed, or they're going nowhere fast.
twicetwice 7y ago
This is why I want Firefox to prioritize Progressive Web App support, and for PWAs to become more popular. Then an open device that can run Firefox can have access to a variety of apps that will work just the same as they would on an Android device. I understand there are drawbacks compared to native, but I really think they're worthwhile tradeoffs to enable new platforms to be immediately compatible with an existing set of cross-platform apps!
- pjmlp 7y ago
  Except it is Google and Microsoft that are driving the show in regards to PWAs and their OS integration.
nine_k 7y ago
I heard FirefoxOS is doing well under a different brand? Does it have interesting apps, I wonder.
- fstephany 7y ago
  It's KaiOS[1]. I think their biggest hit was the JioPhone in theIndian market[2] but the phone lineup is quite impressive for an alternative system. They've got some funding from Google[3] as well. [1]: https://www.kaiostech.com/ https://www.kaiostech.com/ [2]: https://www.financialexpress.com/industry/technology/reliances-jiophone-no-longer-top-selling-feature-phone-loses-spot-to-samsung/1745497/ https://www.financialexpress.com/industry/technology/relianc... [3]: https://www.theverge.com/2018/6/28/17513036/google-kaios-investment-feature-phones-firefox-os-apps-services-strategy https://www.theverge.com/2018/6/28/17513036/google-kaios-inv...

pabs3 7y ago

I expect there are more blobs than just the modem, for example the USB controller(s).

Iolaum 7y ago

RE: prices. Anecdotally I m happy with the ~$150 price tag. Those phones are not going to be daily drivers any time soon. I m much happier to buy a secondary phone for ~$150 than ~$400. I also suspect that a phone with hardware closer to a ~$400 android phone would be much harder to support with open source software/drivers.

pwdisswordfish2 7y ago

> the behaviour of the company is kind of sketchy Can you elaborate?