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>Transplant when I was a kid. For 30+ years, I had it pounded into my head that surgical masks will not protect me. Especially if I share a space with others fo

>Transplant when I was a kid. For 30+ years, I had it pounded into my head that surgical masks will not protect me. Especially if I share a space with others for longer than 30 minutes. Because exhaled water vapor saturates the mask and then air comes around the sides. This is not exactly right. It is correct that no mask (not even an N95) provides complete protection. But surgical masks do provide significant protection. As an immunocompromised individual, I want the best protection money can buy of course. But this is different than saying that surgical masks don't protect you, which is incorrect. >WHO, CDC, others were not "wrong". Just out of date. It takes longer than instantaneous transmission for best available science to percolate out. Especially in a noisy environment. Well, they were wrong. Masks protect in both directions, obviously. I can point you to the science on this if you're in doubt. But a simple way to think about it is why do doctors wear surgical masks in the Covid ward when N95's are unavailable? The answer is simple some filtration is better than no filtration. >But the hard data is still very fresh. It's not. Most of what we know about masks came from research in the early 2000's after SARS. >Further, none of the advice, messaging was making a distinction between masks and respirators AND many people hoarded respirators AND healthcare workers haven't gotten the N95 PPE they need. Another common misconception. Hoarding had basically nil effect on this. I understand that governments have tried to blame hoarders for their own failure to stockpile before this happened, but it's not actually based in reality. Average people started buy masks at a higher pace in January and February which pretty much instantly cleared out any store inventory. By the way, this store inventory has basically nil impact on the availability of respirators for the millions of healthcare workers in the country. Before regular stores could be refreshed, hospitals and governments commandeered the supply chains for all quality respirators. A normal person buying a surgical mask these days has zero effect on the ability of hospital staff to get them. >Of all the things which went sideways, the suboptimal advice on masks, now since revised, isn't even in the top 10. Dwelling on it while we're still not taking the steps to end social distancing seems premature. There will be plenty of time to apportion blame later. What else is in your top 10. The lies about masks are very close to the top for me. The only thing worse would be the WHO loudly proclaiming there was no evidence of human to human spread when we all knew (including the WHO) that human to human spread was likely happening by then. The WHO had already briefed world leaders on that. Why didn't they tell the public?

specialist 6y ago
"I can point you to the science on this if you're in doubt. ... Most of what we know about masks came from research in the early 2000's after SARS." Yes please. I'll be pretty grumpy if my care providers were misinformed or worse. "The answer is simple some filtration is better than no filtration." For 30 minutes. The concern has always been that laypersons wouldn't understand the limitations and risks. "What else is in your top 10." You just wrote that govt didn't stockpile enough masks. "The WHO had already briefed world leaders on that. Why didn't they tell the public?" Well, ya. If WHO, CDC, White House, or whomever, flat out lied, even by omission, then pile on.
- bobbydroptables 6y ago
  >Yes please. I'll be pretty grumpy if my care providers were misinformed or worse. The evidence is plain. Masks work and they save lives. This has been an unfortunate misinformation campaign that they don't. The intention was to save masks for healthcare workers but it failed at that for a number of reasons. https://stacks.cdc.gov/view/cdc/44313 https://stacks.cdc.gov/view/cdc/44313 Also, keep in mind that whether they work at preventing the spread of corona is a very different question than whether a doctor would recommend them to an immunocompromised person in X situation. So it's hard for me to say if your doctor was wrong without knowing precisely what she said. >For 30 minutes. The concern has always been that laypersons wouldn't understand the limitations and risks. Masks don't stop working after 30 minutes. Laypersons don't understand the full risks inherent in using condoms, but we don't tell them not to use condoms. We do educate them. Masks do not provide perfect protection for any length of time. But we're not trying to obtain perfect protection. We're trying to do 1% better than the alternative course of action. (Even procedure masks, by the way, do much more than 1%, which is why it's important for everyone to wear them). >You just wrote that govt didn't stockpile enough masks. I meant I'm curious to see which other 10 things are more important than a massive misinformation campaign about masks that will cost thousands of lives. What are the other 10? >Well, ya. If WHO, CDC, White House, or whomever, flat out lied, even by omission, then pile on. They did, and I am.
specialist 6y ago
Followup... "Hoarding had basically nil effect on this." Thanks. Being ever skeptical, I had to read up. I've since learned that you are correct. The feds didn't replenish their stockpile. And no one else built their own stockpile up. (Of course, there's always more to the story.) I'm contrite that I fell for the official line. Again.

specialist 6y ago

"I can point you to the science on this if you're in doubt. ... Most of what we know about masks came from research in the early 2000's after SARS." Yes please. I'll be pretty grumpy if my care providers were misinformed or worse. "The answer is simple some filtration is better than no filtration." For 30 minutes. The concern has always been that laypersons wouldn't understand the limitations and risks. "What else is in your top 10." You just wrote that govt didn't stockpile enough masks. "The WHO had already briefed world leaders on that. Why didn't they tell the public?" Well, ya. If WHO, CDC, White House, or whomever, flat out lied, even by omission, then pile on.

bobbydroptables 6y ago
>Yes please. I'll be pretty grumpy if my care providers were misinformed or worse. The evidence is plain. Masks work and they save lives. This has been an unfortunate misinformation campaign that they don't. The intention was to save masks for healthcare workers but it failed at that for a number of reasons. https://stacks.cdc.gov/view/cdc/44313 https://stacks.cdc.gov/view/cdc/44313 Also, keep in mind that whether they work at preventing the spread of corona is a very different question than whether a doctor would recommend them to an immunocompromised person in X situation. So it's hard for me to say if your doctor was wrong without knowing precisely what she said. >For 30 minutes. The concern has always been that laypersons wouldn't understand the limitations and risks. Masks don't stop working after 30 minutes. Laypersons don't understand the full risks inherent in using condoms, but we don't tell them not to use condoms. We do educate them. Masks do not provide perfect protection for any length of time. But we're not trying to obtain perfect protection. We're trying to do 1% better than the alternative course of action. (Even procedure masks, by the way, do much more than 1%, which is why it's important for everyone to wear them). >You just wrote that govt didn't stockpile enough masks. I meant I'm curious to see which other 10 things are more important than a massive misinformation campaign about masks that will cost thousands of lives. What are the other 10? >Well, ya. If WHO, CDC, White House, or whomever, flat out lied, even by omission, then pile on. They did, and I am.

specialist 6y ago

Followup... "Hoarding had basically nil effect on this." Thanks. Being ever skeptical, I had to read up. I've since learned that you are correct. The feds didn't replenish their stockpile. And no one else built their own stockpile up. (Of course, there's always more to the story.) I'm contrite that I fell for the official line. Again.