4 ms·

Ever heard the phrase, "don't let perfect be the enemy of good?" I tend to think of Linux as "good" and GNU Hurd as "perfect".

arpa 7y ago
I believe that 2020 is the year of windows server, linux desktop and GNU Hurd 1.0
- znpy 7y ago
  Considering how 2020 has gone so far...
- yellowapple 7y ago
  I believe it's only a matter of time before we figure out how to get Intel ME to directly access the UEFI framebuffer and expose it as an X server, thus ushering in the Year of the Minix Desktop instantaneously on all PCs with Intel CPUs manufactured in the last decade.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
kqr 7y ago
Also known as "worse is better" software. Create a program that is as small as possible, fast, simple in implementation, and reliable. Then build more on top of that. Even if the interfaces to this program have some rough edges, it will knock the "perfect design" or even the "good enough" version out of the park.
- SkyMarshal 7y ago
  It’s the “reliable” part in your list that’s been problematic with monolithic kernels. Cramming the entire OS into the kernel was fast and simple, but exposed attack vectors and enabled bugs in drivers and other stuff to freeze the kernel. Not reliable.
loeg 7y ago
I tend to think of Hurd as "bad."
SkyMarshal 7y ago
Or you could think of Minix as perfect. Or SEL4 as perfect. Or QNX as perfect. No need to cherry pick Hurd for your example when there are shipping microkernels.
rurban 7y ago
Hurd and Mach did the Microkernel thing wrong. L4 did it right, and it's colleagues. No receiver mailboxes. Either the reveicer is ready to pick it up the message, or it is lost. Just like with signals. Huge mistake. Though I do know other permissive real-time kernels with mailboxes. Which do work fine in the industry, like in automobile and airplanes/rockets. Or even darwin. So maybe there's a second big problem in the Hurd design I'm not aware of.

arpa 7y ago

I believe that 2020 is the year of windows server, linux desktop and GNU Hurd 1.0

znpy 7y ago
Considering how 2020 has gone so far...
yellowapple 7y ago
I believe it's only a matter of time before we figure out how to get Intel ME to directly access the UEFI framebuffer and expose it as an X server, thus ushering in the Year of the Minix Desktop instantaneously on all PCs with Intel CPUs manufactured in the last decade.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

kqr 7y ago

Also known as "worse is better" software. Create a program that is as small as possible, fast, simple in implementation, and reliable. Then build more on top of that. Even if the interfaces to this program have some rough edges, it will knock the "perfect design" or even the "good enough" version out of the park.

SkyMarshal 7y ago
It’s the “reliable” part in your list that’s been problematic with monolithic kernels. Cramming the entire OS into the kernel was fast and simple, but exposed attack vectors and enabled bugs in drivers and other stuff to freeze the kernel. Not reliable.

loeg 7y ago

I tend to think of Hurd as "bad."

SkyMarshal 7y ago

Or you could think of Minix as perfect. Or SEL4 as perfect. Or QNX as perfect. No need to cherry pick Hurd for your example when there are shipping microkernels.

rurban 7y ago

Hurd and Mach did the Microkernel thing wrong. L4 did it right, and it's colleagues. No receiver mailboxes. Either the reveicer is ready to pick it up the message, or it is lost. Just like with signals. Huge mistake. Though I do know other permissive real-time kernels with mailboxes. Which do work fine in the industry, like in automobile and airplanes/rockets. Or even darwin. So maybe there's a second big problem in the Hurd design I'm not aware of.