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> There's usually not a relationship that goes the other way though, for example, developers don't tell DBAs to pick up code so they can write the models in our

> There's usually not a relationship that goes the other way though, for example, developers don't tell DBAs to pick up code so they can write the models in our language in addition to the underlying SQL. This highlights a trend of increasing responsibilities pushed onto the developer. Yes, because as a developer you're the one who has the responsibility of implementing the business requirements of the app. There's no trend here; this is the way it's always been. The buck stops with development for a lot of things. The developer is in a unique position to respond to many incidents because they have an intimate understanding of how the business requirements wed with the technology in ways someone like a DBA does not. DBA's have plenty of responsibilities of their own, such as handling a 3AM alarm that goes off when some part on the application starts hammering the DB from some poorly designed N+1 query problem in the codebase. Often times when the DBA tries to teach the developer it's because he's sick of getting those 3AM wake-up calls. > But in some cases it's specialists designating what an expert developer should know. It's giving away control in some respects. This turns into new job requirements and a higher barrier for entry. The growth will need to stop at some point. That's a strange mindset to have. Different jobs have different technologies, and as a developer you learn how to work with them. The specialists aren't designating anything, the job you're responsible for is.

vsareto 6y ago
>Often times when the DBA tries to teach the developer it's because he's sick of getting those 3AM wake-up calls. And if he just learned to code, he could write all the queries himself, check in his own code, and never have 3AM calls. I see no reason why a DBA couldn't manage to write queries in source, especially with some hand-holding w.r.t. source control and check-in rituals. If they are already doing too much, just hire or train more of them. DBAs are equally as smart as devs. Loop DBAs into the business requirements. >That's a strange mindset to have. Different jobs have different technologies, and as a developer you learn how to work with them. The specialists aren't designating anything, the job you're responsible for is. This is very push/pull about who should own what and I personally think devs are often responsible for too much. In silo'd places, make no mistake that input is gathered about who owns what. In more collaborative environments, you see the other sides willing to step in and share the responsibilities; blurred lines, but they are still there. What we've adopted is an over-reliance that a dev will just learn many things and we hope he's good enough at all of them that we don't really need deep knowledge or need to delegate work.

vsareto 6y ago

>Often times when the DBA tries to teach the developer it's because he's sick of getting those 3AM wake-up calls. And if he just learned to code, he could write all the queries himself, check in his own code, and never have 3AM calls. I see no reason why a DBA couldn't manage to write queries in source, especially with some hand-holding w.r.t. source control and check-in rituals. If they are already doing too much, just hire or train more of them. DBAs are equally as smart as devs. Loop DBAs into the business requirements. >That's a strange mindset to have. Different jobs have different technologies, and as a developer you learn how to work with them. The specialists aren't designating anything, the job you're responsible for is. This is very push/pull about who should own what and I personally think devs are often responsible for too much. In silo'd places, make no mistake that input is gathered about who owns what. In more collaborative environments, you see the other sides willing to step in and share the responsibilities; blurred lines, but they are still there. What we've adopted is an over-reliance that a dev will just learn many things and we hope he's good enough at all of them that we don't really need deep knowledge or need to delegate work.