5 ms·

Networking noob here. Can‘t the ISP see Netflix‘s ASN/commonly used IP‘s and shape that way?

gsnedders 6y ago
Yes. The case where it's much more useful is traffic going in/out of major CDNs to shared IP addresses. For Netflix or someone else running their own CDN the gains are much smaller.
- MaxBarraclough 6y ago
  So ISPs could still impose traffic shaping on Netflix if they wanted to, I take it? I can't see how Netflix could prevent this. Ultimately, their servers ('OCAs') have easily detectable IP addresses, right?
  - throwaway287391 6y ago
    Fast.com probably helps quite a bit. If ISPs throttle Netflix' traffic their fast.com measurements will look bad and customers will complain/sue. (AFAIK there's no way to distinguish between fast.com tests and actual Netflix video consumption since the former's traffic patterns are identical(?) to a Netflix video streaming client's.) Creating fast.com always seemed like a pretty brilliant move by Netflix to me.
    - MaxBarraclough 6y ago
      Good point. Smaller players can't make the same move though.
    - Tijdreiziger 6y ago
      I think that was the whole point of fast.com, right? Speeds to known 'speedtest' servers were manipulated by ISPs, and this was bad for Netflix's business because customers would ostensibly have good speeds yet have slow Netflix, so fast.com was created as a way to measure the 'real' speed to Netflix's servers.
      - throwaway287391 6y ago
        Yeah, that's what I was saying (or at least trying to say).
daurnimator 6y ago
IIRC netflix mostly use AWS these days. So checking IPs will just check for anything AWS hosted.
- profmonocle 6y ago
  For the web site and UI, yes. But the actual video traffic comes from a private CDN: https://openconnect.netflix.com https://openconnect.netflix.com
lclarkmichalek 6y ago
Both the replies here miss the fact that the relationship between Netflix and ISPs is often pretty cooperative. Specifically, Netflix will provide ISPs with devices to do caching. The ISPs need to install and run these devices, configure the routes to send traffic to them, etc etc. Details: https://openconnect.netflix.com/en/ https://openconnect.netflix.com/en/. Because of that (and various other things), it's very easy for ISPs to attribute traffic to Netflix.

Yes. The case where it's much more useful is traffic going in/out of major CDNs to shared IP addresses. For Netflix or someone else running their own CDN the gains are much smaller.

MaxBarraclough 6y ago
So ISPs could still impose traffic shaping on Netflix if they wanted to, I take it? I can't see how Netflix could prevent this. Ultimately, their servers ('OCAs') have easily detectable IP addresses, right?
- throwaway287391 6y ago
  Fast.com probably helps quite a bit. If ISPs throttle Netflix' traffic their fast.com measurements will look bad and customers will complain/sue. (AFAIK there's no way to distinguish between fast.com tests and actual Netflix video consumption since the former's traffic patterns are identical(?) to a Netflix video streaming client's.) Creating fast.com always seemed like a pretty brilliant move by Netflix to me.
  - MaxBarraclough 6y ago
    Good point. Smaller players can't make the same move though.
  - Tijdreiziger 6y ago
    I think that was the whole point of fast.com, right? Speeds to known 'speedtest' servers were manipulated by ISPs, and this was bad for Netflix's business because customers would ostensibly have good speeds yet have slow Netflix, so fast.com was created as a way to measure the 'real' speed to Netflix's servers.
    - throwaway287391 6y ago
      Yeah, that's what I was saying (or at least trying to say).

daurnimator 6y ago

IIRC netflix mostly use AWS these days. So checking IPs will just check for anything AWS hosted.

profmonocle 6y ago
For the web site and UI, yes. But the actual video traffic comes from a private CDN: https://openconnect.netflix.com https://openconnect.netflix.com

lclarkmichalek 6y ago

Both the replies here miss the fact that the relationship between Netflix and ISPs is often pretty cooperative. Specifically, Netflix will provide ISPs with devices to do caching. The ISPs need to install and run these devices, configure the routes to send traffic to them, etc etc. Details: https://openconnect.netflix.com/en/ https://openconnect.netflix.com/en/. Because of that (and various other things), it's very easy for ISPs to attribute traffic to Netflix.