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>I see little reason to doubt that all involved are trying to minimize general death and misery, even if they may disagree radically about how to do that. Wait

>I see little reason to doubt that all involved are trying to minimize general death and misery, even if they may disagree radically about how to do that. Wait, are you talking about the people who want to send everyone back to work now, even though we don't even have masks for doctors yet? Are you saying they are trying to minimize death and misery? Or are we talking about completely different people here?

downerending 6y ago
I don't know about the particular motives of each protester. But it's obvious that there are large numbers of people facing immediate financial ruin. And very shortly thereafter, risk of death for themselves and their loved ones. I'm not in that situation, but I wouldn't be caught dead silencing their voices.
- SerLava 6y ago
  The answer to financial ruin is not to force everyone back into contact again, it's to give normal people their fair share of the bailout. We took something like 15,000 dollars out of everyone's future earnings for the bailout, and threw them back 1,200 of it. With those people taken care of, the protests are reduced to landowners demanding blood for their haircuts and Fuddruckers.
  - downerending 6y ago
    I don't think the protesters are asking for people to be forced back into contact. (though admittedly, restarting will mean pressure on those who'd rather not) And I seriously doubt any of the protesters are landowners, aside, perhaps from "owning" their houses. ("owning" == mortgages, in most cases)
nopriorarrests 6y ago
>Wait, are you talking about the people who want to send everyone back to work now This is an argument made in a bad faith. You can't send "everyone to work now", if you are not running a gulag. People who are financially secure can stay at home till 2021, nobody can force them to go to work, this is obvious. It's a question of being able to make a personal decision between staying at home or going to work.
- SerLava 6y ago
  >People who are financially secure can stay at home till 2021, nobody can force them to go to work, this is obvious. >It's a question of being able to make a personal decision between staying at home or going to work. Double speak. You mean rich people can decide to quarantine until 2021, and poor people can decide between work followed by exposure and possible death, or homelessness followed by exposure and possible death.
  - nopriorarrests 6y ago
    Why is it double speak? Yes, I think that healthy 29 y.o. male with wife, kid and mortgage should have the ability to make a decision between going to work or losing his home. To make this decision for him looks unethical to me. And why exactly poor? It might be solidly middle class person. EDIT: I'm pushing forties, can sustain myself for 1.5 years without working maintaining the same lifestyle, and I would go to work if I could. I'm damn tired working from home.
    - FpUser 6y ago
      "I'm damn tired working from home." Interesting. I work from home 20 years already and have no desire to sit in a cubicle or waste my time in downtown traffic. I have my own company and products but also develop products for other companies on order and my first ever requirement is that unless there is some super duper meeting I only work at my own premises. Do not feel lonely either as I have enough friends with whom I can socialize to my heart's content whenever we feel like.
      - nopriorarrests 6y ago
        OK, it's not just work from home, it's the whole lockdown hysteria. I barely left my home for last 5 weeks. No live music, no bars, no meetings with friends, no long walks. I don't know about covid, but my mental well being and my productivity are clearly taking a hit. I'm especially annoyed by the fact that weekends are not, in fact, weekends. It is two days of solitary confinement without work.

downerending 6y ago

I don't know about the particular motives of each protester. But it's obvious that there are large numbers of people facing immediate financial ruin. And very shortly thereafter, risk of death for themselves and their loved ones. I'm not in that situation, but I wouldn't be caught dead silencing their voices.

SerLava 6y ago
The answer to financial ruin is not to force everyone back into contact again, it's to give normal people their fair share of the bailout. We took something like 15,000 dollars out of everyone's future earnings for the bailout, and threw them back 1,200 of it. With those people taken care of, the protests are reduced to landowners demanding blood for their haircuts and Fuddruckers.
- downerending 6y ago
  I don't think the protesters are asking for people to be forced back into contact. (though admittedly, restarting will mean pressure on those who'd rather not) And I seriously doubt any of the protesters are landowners, aside, perhaps from "owning" their houses. ("owning" == mortgages, in most cases)

nopriorarrests 6y ago

>Wait, are you talking about the people who want to send everyone back to work now This is an argument made in a bad faith. You can't send "everyone to work now", if you are not running a gulag. People who are financially secure can stay at home till 2021, nobody can force them to go to work, this is obvious. It's a question of being able to make a personal decision between staying at home or going to work.

SerLava 6y ago
>People who are financially secure can stay at home till 2021, nobody can force them to go to work, this is obvious. >It's a question of being able to make a personal decision between staying at home or going to work. Double speak. You mean rich people can decide to quarantine until 2021, and poor people can decide between work followed by exposure and possible death, or homelessness followed by exposure and possible death.
- nopriorarrests 6y ago
  Why is it double speak? Yes, I think that healthy 29 y.o. male with wife, kid and mortgage should have the ability to make a decision between going to work or losing his home. To make this decision for him looks unethical to me. And why exactly poor? It might be solidly middle class person. EDIT: I'm pushing forties, can sustain myself for 1.5 years without working maintaining the same lifestyle, and I would go to work if I could. I'm damn tired working from home.
  - FpUser 6y ago
    "I'm damn tired working from home." Interesting. I work from home 20 years already and have no desire to sit in a cubicle or waste my time in downtown traffic. I have my own company and products but also develop products for other companies on order and my first ever requirement is that unless there is some super duper meeting I only work at my own premises. Do not feel lonely either as I have enough friends with whom I can socialize to my heart's content whenever we feel like.
    - nopriorarrests 6y ago
      OK, it's not just work from home, it's the whole lockdown hysteria. I barely left my home for last 5 weeks. No live music, no bars, no meetings with friends, no long walks. I don't know about covid, but my mental well being and my productivity are clearly taking a hit. I'm especially annoyed by the fact that weekends are not, in fact, weekends. It is two days of solitary confinement without work.