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Are you saying that you would only have one 50% job? Why not just take it as a 100% and find other ways to make best use of your non-productive side. I would r

Are you saying that you would only have one 50% job? Why not just take it as a 100% and find other ways to make best use of your non-productive side. I would rather hire one person working 100% than two people working 50%, because there is less communication overhead.

ISL 6y ago
Not the original poster -- I'm presently trying to arrange my life to accommodate 50% work and 50% family. I know a number of people who would love to do 50% work and 50% life. Life is too short to give 100% to a job unless it is a job you love or it underwrites either love or necessity.
- burlesona 6y ago
  Serious question, what hours do you consider to be 100% of your time? I ask because the current 40-hour schedule was fought for in the early 20th century specifically because it worked out to 50/50: 8 hours for work and 8 hours for “what we may,” each day (allowing the final 8 hours for sleep). Considering Saturdays and Sundays off, that means a 40-hour schedule is only 5/14 of the waking hours per week.
  - iovrthoughtthis 6y ago
    This is my own personal experience. 1. Commuting is exhausting and can easily add between 2-4 hours a day for long commuters (10-20 hours a week). 2. Work can be exhausting, it can feel like you just wake up to go back to sleep. Those 8 hours not sleeping I’ve felt a ghost of my self. 3. There is almost always some expectation of availability to work outside of those hours. I moved to part time / freelance and it has been an enormous quality of life improvement.
    - fjeifisjf 6y ago
      #1 is a poor lifestyle choice. #3 is poor self control and spinelessness in negotiating working schedule.
      - greedo 6y ago
        Not everyone has the skills and leverage to negotiate a schedule that actually suits them best. In most employee/employer relationships, the employer has far more leverage to dictate work schedules and conditions. Being in this situation is caused neither by a lack of self control, or by spinelessness.
        Spooky23 6y ago
        If you’re in a tech role, it’s insane. Unless you’re getting paid some crazy premium amount or have other handcuffs like a contract or defined benefit pension, there is no reason to stay.
        iovrthoughtthis 6y ago
        A lot of the decisions humans make aren't reasonable, as in there is no reason behind them, they are emotional.
      - iovrthoughtthis 6y ago
        #1 Not all choices lead to valid solutions given a set of constraints, this can lead to non-optimal solutions. #3 I personally see the reality that knowledge work and life blend a bit more at the edges than traditional factory work and can accept the need for work outside of the standard hours . It's the existence of this adaptation in working time alongside the other issues I highlighted that makes it a problem. We're in the middle of changing work and these are teething issues. I find your reply overly simple, inconsiderate and from a place of privilege.
  - akersten 6y ago
    > I ask because the current 40-hour schedule was fought for in the early 20th century specifically because it worked out to 50/50: 8 hours for work and 8 hours for “what we may,” each day (allowing the final 8 hours for sleep). The employer is getting a hell of a deal with that arrangement. They'll get their 8 hours a day. Sure, some might be chatter with fellow employees, a little screwing around on a phone, or using the restroom, but by and large it's 8 hours of being at work. We all need 8 hours of sleep, most of us don't get it. If we wanted to actually get 8 hours of good sleep, we need to start getting to bed about an hour before we plan on falling asleep. So let's conservatively call that 9 hours needed for 8 hours of sleep. Going to and from work isn't really "what we may" unless you're telling me I could or should consciously decide to live across the street from my workplace to maximize my me-time. So there's another hour stolen every day. So what are we at - 9 hours requisite for sleep, an hour of commute - leaves us 14 hours split between work and "play," knowing that for most of us who can't afford to hire laborers to take care of our domiciles, much of that "play" becomes "chores." In this scenario, even splitting the difference and affording capital 7 hours of your time each day is theft. We'd all be better off around 4.
    - fjeifisjf 6y ago
      You overlooked that employers pay employees a wage for their working time.
      - akersten 6y ago
        No, I haven't overlooked that, it's just not really relevant. You'd still be paid if the norm for a salaried position were a 16-hour workday, it wouldn't make it any less exploitative. In that scenario, you couldn't "choose" to go work for 8 hours instead and take a loss in pay - no firm is hiring "full-time" at 8 hours - which actually rounds right back to the issue brought up by this thread: you'd be looking for part-time work that doesn't exist.
  - ISL 6y ago
    Good serious question. To me, it means the work-week. It is in my nature to work ~10 hour days on whatever I'm working on (a habit I see across physicists), and it blurs into the weekend. I'm shifting my focus to half-time on physics, a quarter of my time helping aging parents while they're still functional, and a quarter of the time assisting with the family business.
  - ken 6y ago
    My personal time, then, includes such activities as commuting, doing my taxes, going to the doctor/dentist/therapist, updating my licenses/certifications, eating lunch (often at work, by requirement), buying tools/clothes needed for work, and so on. It's hardly the case that I can spend "my" 8 hours with family or friends, or even doing something of my choosing. Come tax day, I can deduct the purchase cost of tools I needed to buy for work, but there's no way to deduct all the hours spent every day on the unpaid activities which are also required for work. It's great that we got our hours of labor down to only 8, but why stop there? I would consider a 50/50 split to be one where I have as much time to make art as I spend at work for someone else. (Or substitute "family" or whatever else your priority is.) Working 8 hours a day, 5 days a week, that's not even physically possible. Maybe at 6 hours.

ISL 6y ago

Not the original poster -- I'm presently trying to arrange my life to accommodate 50% work and 50% family. I know a number of people who would love to do 50% work and 50% life. Life is too short to give 100% to a job unless it is a job you love or it underwrites either love or necessity.

burlesona 6y ago
Serious question, what hours do you consider to be 100% of your time? I ask because the current 40-hour schedule was fought for in the early 20th century specifically because it worked out to 50/50: 8 hours for work and 8 hours for “what we may,” each day (allowing the final 8 hours for sleep). Considering Saturdays and Sundays off, that means a 40-hour schedule is only 5/14 of the waking hours per week.
- iovrthoughtthis 6y ago
  This is my own personal experience. 1. Commuting is exhausting and can easily add between 2-4 hours a day for long commuters (10-20 hours a week). 2. Work can be exhausting, it can feel like you just wake up to go back to sleep. Those 8 hours not sleeping I’ve felt a ghost of my self. 3. There is almost always some expectation of availability to work outside of those hours. I moved to part time / freelance and it has been an enormous quality of life improvement.
  - fjeifisjf 6y ago
    #1 is a poor lifestyle choice. #3 is poor self control and spinelessness in negotiating working schedule.
    - greedo 6y ago
      Not everyone has the skills and leverage to negotiate a schedule that actually suits them best. In most employee/employer relationships, the employer has far more leverage to dictate work schedules and conditions. Being in this situation is caused neither by a lack of self control, or by spinelessness.
      - Spooky23 6y ago
        If you’re in a tech role, it’s insane. Unless you’re getting paid some crazy premium amount or have other handcuffs like a contract or defined benefit pension, there is no reason to stay.
        iovrthoughtthis 6y ago
        A lot of the decisions humans make aren't reasonable, as in there is no reason behind them, they are emotional.
    - iovrthoughtthis 6y ago
      #1 Not all choices lead to valid solutions given a set of constraints, this can lead to non-optimal solutions. #3 I personally see the reality that knowledge work and life blend a bit more at the edges than traditional factory work and can accept the need for work outside of the standard hours . It's the existence of this adaptation in working time alongside the other issues I highlighted that makes it a problem. We're in the middle of changing work and these are teething issues. I find your reply overly simple, inconsiderate and from a place of privilege.
- akersten 6y ago
  > I ask because the current 40-hour schedule was fought for in the early 20th century specifically because it worked out to 50/50: 8 hours for work and 8 hours for “what we may,” each day (allowing the final 8 hours for sleep). The employer is getting a hell of a deal with that arrangement. They'll get their 8 hours a day. Sure, some might be chatter with fellow employees, a little screwing around on a phone, or using the restroom, but by and large it's 8 hours of being at work. We all need 8 hours of sleep, most of us don't get it. If we wanted to actually get 8 hours of good sleep, we need to start getting to bed about an hour before we plan on falling asleep. So let's conservatively call that 9 hours needed for 8 hours of sleep. Going to and from work isn't really "what we may" unless you're telling me I could or should consciously decide to live across the street from my workplace to maximize my me-time. So there's another hour stolen every day. So what are we at - 9 hours requisite for sleep, an hour of commute - leaves us 14 hours split between work and "play," knowing that for most of us who can't afford to hire laborers to take care of our domiciles, much of that "play" becomes "chores." In this scenario, even splitting the difference and affording capital 7 hours of your time each day is theft. We'd all be better off around 4.
  - fjeifisjf 6y ago
    You overlooked that employers pay employees a wage for their working time.
    - akersten 6y ago
      No, I haven't overlooked that, it's just not really relevant. You'd still be paid if the norm for a salaried position were a 16-hour workday, it wouldn't make it any less exploitative. In that scenario, you couldn't "choose" to go work for 8 hours instead and take a loss in pay - no firm is hiring "full-time" at 8 hours - which actually rounds right back to the issue brought up by this thread: you'd be looking for part-time work that doesn't exist.
- ISL 6y ago
  Good serious question. To me, it means the work-week. It is in my nature to work ~10 hour days on whatever I'm working on (a habit I see across physicists), and it blurs into the weekend. I'm shifting my focus to half-time on physics, a quarter of my time helping aging parents while they're still functional, and a quarter of the time assisting with the family business.
- ken 6y ago
  My personal time, then, includes such activities as commuting, doing my taxes, going to the doctor/dentist/therapist, updating my licenses/certifications, eating lunch (often at work, by requirement), buying tools/clothes needed for work, and so on. It's hardly the case that I can spend "my" 8 hours with family or friends, or even doing something of my choosing. Come tax day, I can deduct the purchase cost of tools I needed to buy for work, but there's no way to deduct all the hours spent every day on the unpaid activities which are also required for work. It's great that we got our hours of labor down to only 8, but why stop there? I would consider a 50/50 split to be one where I have as much time to make art as I spend at work for someone else. (Or substitute "family" or whatever else your priority is.) Working 8 hours a day, 5 days a week, that's not even physically possible. Maybe at 6 hours.