5 ms·

If they couldn't make it easier to set I think the clock should have been less prominent. It's necessary if you're doing a scheduled recording. It's too bad t

by pfranz 7y ago

If they couldn't make it easier to set I think the clock should have been less prominent. It's necessary if you're doing a scheduled recording. It's too bad time sync over power lines didn't catch on widely (or broadcast over the radio). It would still be saving everyone from changing their digital clocks during DST.

XorNot 7y ago
The problem was everyone did it once, and then lost power at some point and it went into "minor task not ever important enough to be worth taking the time. If they'd included a backup battery to retain the clock, I suspect it'd been less of a thing.
- Talanes 7y ago
  In the days before power strips were ubiquitous, my VCR got unplugged whenever I played the Sega. There was no way anyone was setting the clock daily.
- pfranz 7y ago
  I still think that's part of the bad UI =) That setup was bad unless you included a battery or time was likely to set itself.
kristopolous 7y ago
Time codes inside of analog terrestrial NTSC sounds really easy and obvious. Given that nobody did it, it would appear that even though legally people like Mr. Rogers were making the case for time-shift programming, the industry must have assumed it was a minor use case.
- Jtsummers 7y ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_Data_Services https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_Data_Services Autoclock setting was done for VCRs. It just happened much later than the case in question.
- a1369209993 7y ago
  > the industry must have assumed it was a minor use case. You mean the same industry that was trying to make time-shifting (and VCRs in general) illegal?
- pfranz 7y ago
  The main reason I mentioned it is that I know I've seen various implementations--they're just not widely adopted. I guess nobody has the business interest to make it all work? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_Data_Services https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_Data_Services (NTSC) looks like a 2008 standard and most PBS stations provide "autoclock" time data https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_Data_System https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_Data_System (FM radio) I figured this had an implementation considering text has been around for years. Amazingly, I don't think I've ever seen a car stereo use it to set the time! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadband_over_power_lines https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadband_over_power_lines I know this has been around but has had a lot of hurdles. I figured the current time might be a simpler thing. The only reliably time-setting tech I've seen integrated is GPS--I'm not 100% sure how time zones work with it, but it does know your location.
lmm 7y ago
> If they couldn't make it easier to set I think the clock should have been less prominent. It's necessary if you're doing a scheduled recording. On the contrary, the clock needs to be super obvious precisely because it's a pain to set. Otherwise you wouldn't notice until your recordings were messed up.
- pfranz 7y ago
  I think context is key. It's only necessary if you have a scheduled recording. So it should only be obvious if you're setting up a scheduled recording or have one queued up. In those cases it should force your or alert you in an obvious manner that the time is not set.
Symbiote 7y ago
Do you not have a radio clock? They're common in Europe, on a midrange bedside clock for example, and typical office/school clocks. I remember we were foiled by one at school, when someone set the clock 15 minutes forward when the teacher wasn't looking. The hands could only move forward, so a few minutes later they started spinning 11½ hours further forward to set the correct time. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_clock https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_clock
- pfranz 7y ago
  Interesting. I think I've seen those things, but I've never bought one. I was expecting this tech would be built into microwaves, ovens, and cars by now.
thewebcount 7y ago
They tried compromises like VCR Plus+[0]. It was basically a 6 digit code that would be printed next to the show name in places like TV Guide. You would enter the code into your VCR instead of a time, and it would figure out how to record it. I think it still required a working clock, though. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_recorder_scheduling_code https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_recorder_scheduling_code
Animats 7y ago
Time over analog TV signals was supported in EIA-608, the standard for sending closed captions and other data in one line of the vertical retrace interval. PBS stations used to send it. Few things used that data. In the 1990s I encountered a hotel TV with that feature. It had a built-in clock with hands (not on screen), which was also the alarm clock for the room. No one had set it up, and I spent about ten minutes with the remote getting it to find a station with time info and set the clock. Then the "alarm set" function on the remote would work and I could set my wake-up time.

by pfranz 7y ago

XorNot 7y ago

The problem was everyone did it once, and then lost power at some point and it went into "minor task not ever important enough to be worth taking the time. If they'd included a backup battery to retain the clock, I suspect it'd been less of a thing.

Talanes 7y ago
In the days before power strips were ubiquitous, my VCR got unplugged whenever I played the Sega. There was no way anyone was setting the clock daily.
pfranz 7y ago
I still think that's part of the bad UI =) That setup was bad unless you included a battery or time was likely to set itself.

kristopolous 7y ago

Time codes inside of analog terrestrial NTSC sounds really easy and obvious. Given that nobody did it, it would appear that even though legally people like Mr. Rogers were making the case for time-shift programming, the industry must have assumed it was a minor use case.

Jtsummers 7y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_Data_Services https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_Data_Services Autoclock setting was done for VCRs. It just happened much later than the case in question.
a1369209993 7y ago
> the industry must have assumed it was a minor use case. You mean the same industry that was trying to make time-shifting (and VCRs in general) illegal?
pfranz 7y ago
The main reason I mentioned it is that I know I've seen various implementations--they're just not widely adopted. I guess nobody has the business interest to make it all work? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_Data_Services https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_Data_Services (NTSC) looks like a 2008 standard and most PBS stations provide "autoclock" time data https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_Data_System https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_Data_System (FM radio) I figured this had an implementation considering text has been around for years. Amazingly, I don't think I've ever seen a car stereo use it to set the time! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadband_over_power_lines https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadband_over_power_lines I know this has been around but has had a lot of hurdles. I figured the current time might be a simpler thing. The only reliably time-setting tech I've seen integrated is GPS--I'm not 100% sure how time zones work with it, but it does know your location.

lmm 7y ago

> If they couldn't make it easier to set I think the clock should have been less prominent. It's necessary if you're doing a scheduled recording. On the contrary, the clock needs to be super obvious precisely because it's a pain to set. Otherwise you wouldn't notice until your recordings were messed up.

pfranz 7y ago
I think context is key. It's only necessary if you have a scheduled recording. So it should only be obvious if you're setting up a scheduled recording or have one queued up. In those cases it should force your or alert you in an obvious manner that the time is not set.

Symbiote 7y ago

Do you not have a radio clock? They're common in Europe, on a midrange bedside clock for example, and typical office/school clocks. I remember we were foiled by one at school, when someone set the clock 15 minutes forward when the teacher wasn't looking. The hands could only move forward, so a few minutes later they started spinning 11½ hours further forward to set the correct time. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_clock https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_clock

pfranz 7y ago
Interesting. I think I've seen those things, but I've never bought one. I was expecting this tech would be built into microwaves, ovens, and cars by now.

thewebcount 7y ago

They tried compromises like VCR Plus+[0]. It was basically a 6 digit code that would be printed next to the show name in places like TV Guide. You would enter the code into your VCR instead of a time, and it would figure out how to record it. I think it still required a working clock, though. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_recorder_scheduling_code https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_recorder_scheduling_code

Animats 7y ago

Time over analog TV signals was supported in EIA-608, the standard for sending closed captions and other data in one line of the vertical retrace interval. PBS stations used to send it. Few things used that data. In the 1990s I encountered a hotel TV with that feature. It had a built-in clock with hands (not on screen), which was also the alarm clock for the room. No one had set it up, and I spent about ten minutes with the remote getting it to find a station with time info and set the clock. Then the "alarm set" function on the remote would work and I could set my wake-up time.