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One of the arguments, given in the Supreme Court, by Mr. Rogers, to permit the VCR to be legally owned (I know how crazy this is sounding but it's real) was to

One of the arguments, given in the Supreme Court, by Mr. Rogers, to permit the VCR to be legally owned (I know how crazy this is sounding but it's real) was to time shift programming ... which requires a functioning clock. Fred Rogers, 1984: "I have always felt that with the advent of all of this new technology that allows people to tape the 'Neighborhood' off-the-air ... they then become much more active in the programming of their family’s television life. Very frankly, I am opposed to people being programmed by others. My whole approach in broadcasting has always been ‘You are an important person just the way you are. You can make healthy decisions’ ... I just feel that anything that allows a person to be more active in the control of his or her life, in a healthy way, is important." see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_Corp._of_America_v._Universal_City_Studios,_Inc https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_Corp._of_America_v._Unive.... There's definitely non-crazy ways of doing this ... but it requires what at first blush, would appear to be a complicated interface.

aspenmayer 7y ago
Just when I thought I couldn’t be thankful enough to Fred Rogers for saving public television in America as he transformed what it could be, now I find out that he’s also pivotal in standing up for fair use rights and inadvertently supported the analog hole before the digital one was even invented to be closed. He truly was a person who stood up for his beliefs on behalf of the fellow person and an example of goodness in the world without pandering or compromise. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analog_hole https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analog_hole
gowld 7y ago
Time shifting doesn't require a clock, if you are home to start recording, but a clock helps with programmatic recording.
- lmm 7y ago
  That's an extreme nitpick. The whole argument for time shifting is to be able to record something while you're not at home.
  - aspenmayer 7y ago
    Let’s hear them out in the spirit of debate. I’m curious how this hypothetical VCR is programmed, what the remote and interface might look like. I might even like it, or at least want parts of it as concepts to integrate with other things that already exist. Could shake loose some ideas. Honestly I don’t know why VCRs are so hard to program but all of the buttons can’t help. I might be getting old but the Roku remote seems about right as far as complexity in the device goes and I can see how a nice interface with relative timekeeping could do what you need without a clock per se. Inertial guidance for timekeeping? A self winding DVR?
    - Fr0styMatt88 7y ago
      I remember what setting the time on a VCR was like and it's interesting to think of all the assumed knowledge you actually need in order to have it seem intuitive. Two things off the top of my head that I can think of: 1) knowing that a blinking number is indicating some kind of selection and more generally 2) seeing the UI as a glimpse into a larger abstract space that can be navigated. Or in other words, having used computers for many years, what my parents sawzl as just a blinking word, I would see as a menu where up/down/left/right had meaning. There's also some more abstract thinking involved there - for me it's very spatial so I think of it as being able to keep track of your place in this 'abstract map'. You had to learn some non-obvious things like "if the down button stops working, it probably means I'm at the 'bottom' of my available choices" or "if I start seeing the same choices again, it means I have 'wrapped around' and in a logical sense I'm back to where I've been before". I actually remember thinking something like this as a child when we got a VCR. I think I remember that realization that "this is a menu I can explore". The exploratory skills you pick up when you have to figure out how to use something technical generalize really well to other technical things. TL;DR: I think VCRs were hard to program because the limited UI of buttons and a tiny screen meant that you actually needed a fairly built-up mental model of the process to keep track of what you were doing.
      - disqard 7y ago
        This is a great observation! The blinking-indicates-editable-via-buttons-mode is a mental model you either have or you do not. It is certainly not axiomatic and needs some experimentation to learn. Digital writwatches with those standard three buttons also relied on this mental model.
hilbert42 7y ago
"https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_Corp._of_America_v._Universal_City_Studios,_Inc https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_Corp._of_America_v._Unive.... " Ha, reading that link now one feels a delicious sense of irony. Imagine how Sony would react today seeing that it has become one of the biggest purveyors of video/movie content. ;-)

aspenmayer 7y ago

Just when I thought I couldn’t be thankful enough to Fred Rogers for saving public television in America as he transformed what it could be, now I find out that he’s also pivotal in standing up for fair use rights and inadvertently supported the analog hole before the digital one was even invented to be closed. He truly was a person who stood up for his beliefs on behalf of the fellow person and an example of goodness in the world without pandering or compromise. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analog_hole https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analog_hole

gowld 7y ago

Time shifting doesn't require a clock, if you are home to start recording, but a clock helps with programmatic recording.

lmm 7y ago
That's an extreme nitpick. The whole argument for time shifting is to be able to record something while you're not at home.
- aspenmayer 7y ago
  Let’s hear them out in the spirit of debate. I’m curious how this hypothetical VCR is programmed, what the remote and interface might look like. I might even like it, or at least want parts of it as concepts to integrate with other things that already exist. Could shake loose some ideas. Honestly I don’t know why VCRs are so hard to program but all of the buttons can’t help. I might be getting old but the Roku remote seems about right as far as complexity in the device goes and I can see how a nice interface with relative timekeeping could do what you need without a clock per se. Inertial guidance for timekeeping? A self winding DVR?
  - Fr0styMatt88 7y ago
    I remember what setting the time on a VCR was like and it's interesting to think of all the assumed knowledge you actually need in order to have it seem intuitive. Two things off the top of my head that I can think of: 1) knowing that a blinking number is indicating some kind of selection and more generally 2) seeing the UI as a glimpse into a larger abstract space that can be navigated. Or in other words, having used computers for many years, what my parents sawzl as just a blinking word, I would see as a menu where up/down/left/right had meaning. There's also some more abstract thinking involved there - for me it's very spatial so I think of it as being able to keep track of your place in this 'abstract map'. You had to learn some non-obvious things like "if the down button stops working, it probably means I'm at the 'bottom' of my available choices" or "if I start seeing the same choices again, it means I have 'wrapped around' and in a logical sense I'm back to where I've been before". I actually remember thinking something like this as a child when we got a VCR. I think I remember that realization that "this is a menu I can explore". The exploratory skills you pick up when you have to figure out how to use something technical generalize really well to other technical things. TL;DR: I think VCRs were hard to program because the limited UI of buttons and a tiny screen meant that you actually needed a fairly built-up mental model of the process to keep track of what you were doing.
    - disqard 7y ago
      This is a great observation! The blinking-indicates-editable-via-buttons-mode is a mental model you either have or you do not. It is certainly not axiomatic and needs some experimentation to learn. Digital writwatches with those standard three buttons also relied on this mental model.

hilbert42 7y ago

"https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_Corp._of_America_v._Universal_City_Studios,_Inc https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_Corp._of_America_v._Unive.... " Ha, reading that link now one feels a delicious sense of irony. Imagine how Sony would react today seeing that it has become one of the biggest purveyors of video/movie content. ;-)