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I'm French. In french "gouvernement" (french word for "government") only refers to the executive branch, and our justice system is strongly attached to its inde
by Darkstryder 7y ago
I'm French. In french "gouvernement" (french word for "government") only refers to the executive branch, and our justice system is strongly attached to its independence from the two other branches. So it seems strange to me to conflate all three branches together.
Interestingly, in the French wikipedia page for "gouvernement" [1], there is this paragraph :
Différence avec le terme anglais
En anglais, le mot « government » s'applique non seulement au gouvernement au sens où on l'entend en français, mais aussi aux collectivités territoriales et aux administrations publiques, aussi bien centrales que locales. Le concept le plus proche en français est donc celui de collectivité publique, qui englobe les institutions politiques qui incarnent directement les pouvoirs législatif, exécutif et judiciaire, ainsi que l'ensemble des administrations qui leur sont rattachées.
Which can be loosely translated as :
Difference with the english term
In English, the word "government" includes not only the executive governement like in French, but also all local and global public administrations. The closest concept in french is therefore "collectivité publique" which encompasses institutions for all Legislative, Executive, Judiciary powers, as well as all administrations under their authorities.
I learnt something new today.
[1] https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gouvernement https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gouvernement
- umanwizard 7y agoIMO, the closest French term to the American English term "government" is État.
- mikeg8 7y agoThanks for sharing. I learned something too. What’s interesting to me is that, at least in America, we associate the judicial as government because we consider ourselves a “land of law” and the judicial has the responsibility of determining if the laws that “govern” how we can act have been used appropriately or if they violate our constitutional rights. As a French citizen, do you not feel governed by the laws which your courts oversee? Maybe this is purely a difference in language but it’s very fascinating to me.
- umanwizard 7y agoI'm American too (and not the French person you were responding to). IMO it's just an accidental quirk of language. Laws are just as important in other developed nations too.
- Darkstryder 7y agoI would have trouble talking about the difference between American and French views of the law, or even speaking for all French people for that matter. What I can say is that personally, I definitely think I live in a country ruled by law. However separation of powers means there is no single entity exercising total control on this law: the executive branch proposes changes to the law, the legislative ratifies these changes (or not), and the judiciary branch is an arbiter of what happens when the existing law meets real life situations. While the limits between the executive and legislative branches can sometimes feel porous (especially when executive and legislative are controlled by a single political party, as is the case in both France and USA at the moment), the judiciary branch always felt more insular to me from the two others, at least in my country. Another linguistic nuance to think about: in French, we are "ruled by law " but not "governed by law". In French, "gouverner" (to govern) is something that people do, not laws. This is a bit of a brain dump, sorry. I wish I would have more definitive answers for you.
- ensignavenger 6y agoIn the US right now, the legislative branch is actually split between the two major parties- the Republicans control the Senate, but the Democrats control the House of Representatives. Any new laws have to be approved by both sides of the legislature.
- Darkstryder 6y agoYou’re right, and actually this is also true in France: the party in power only controls one of the two chambers but not the other.
- mikeg8 6y agoNo apologies, your answer makes a lot of sense. Thank you for replying and sharing your perspective. Hope all is well.