10 ms·

I think this is a polite way of these states saying that they're not going to follow any 'national plan to reopen the economy' put out by the White House.

by mjcl 6y ago

lisper 6y ago
Exactly right. One of the rules of the game is that you're not allowed to say anything negative about Donald Trump even if (perhaps especially if) it is factually correct. If you do, he will retaliate (by, for example, withholding badly needed aid). So the governors have to speak in code. Listen to Newsome's news conference today and the answer he gave to a reporter about his reaction to Trump's announcement that the decision to re-open the economy is his (Trump's) alone. It's a masterpiece.
- rlt 6y ago
  > If you do, he will retaliate (by, for example, withholding badly needed aid) Has this actually occurred? I know NY asked for way more ventilators than they got, but as I understood it they were giving them out "just in time" rather than up front in case they were needed more elsewhere.
  - aboodman 6y ago
    Yes, it was withheld for several days for Michigan: https://www.metrotimes.com/news-hits/archives/2020/03/28/after-demanding-praise-trump-finally-approves-coronavirus-aid-for-michigan https://www.metrotimes.com/news-hits/archives/2020/03/28/aft...
  - jschwartzi 6y ago
    Yes. Early in the outbreak, several of the western states including Washington asked for full FEMA aid but received nothing except some disaster counseling aid, while Florida received huge shipments of medical supplies. Trump as much as said he was waiting for Governor Jay Inslee of Washington to say something nice about him before opening up aid to Washington, which is unconscionable. We seem to be doing just fine here without the Federal Government. In fact we've sent 400 ventilators back to the national stockpile and we also returned the Army hospital that was established at Safeco Field back because we didn't need the capacity. Trump did eventually authorize FEMA to pay for the National Guard response here.
  - tmh79 6y ago
    There are also lots of reports of confiscations of PPE: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/06/us/politics/coronavirus-fema-medical-supplies.html https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/06/us/politics/coronavirus-f... https://www.firehouse.com/safety-health/ppe/news/21133559/feds-confiscate-ppe-gowns-from-ma-fire-department-chief-says https://www.firehouse.com/safety-health/ppe/news/21133559/fe... https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/fema-denies-involvement-in-ppe-seizures https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/fema-denies-involvement... I hate to be a conspiracy theorist, but this smells real bad to me. The reports of confiscations are coming from democratic states, not republican states. And it seems like republican lobbyists are getting into the game of distributing PPE: https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/bob-livingston-group-mike-gula-blue-flame-national-governors-association-covid-19-coronavirus-supplies-n95 https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/bob-livingston-group-mike... What it seems to me is happening is a coordinated yet amateurish attempt to restrict the PPE flow to/within democratic states, while allowing the free flow of PPE in republican states. This allows some lobbyists to make money off of it, as well as sticking a finger in the eye of dem leaders (and dying people/healthcare workers in dem states).
    - rlt 6y ago
      > https://www.firehouse.com/safety-health/ppe/news/21133559/feds-confiscate-ppe-gowns-from-ma-fire-department-chief-says https://www.firehouse.com/safety-health/ppe/news/21133559/fe... On the other hand, does the fire department for a town of 27,000 people really need 30,000 gowns, or could those be put to better use elsewhere?
    - jakeogh 6y ago
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1-GrBy67LY http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1-GrBy67LY
  - bredren 6y ago
    It isn't only about who it is withheld from, it is who is favored and given to. Florida, where President Trump moved his residence to and who's governor he enjoys a special relationship with, has had greater success than other states in requesting and receiving allocations from the federal stockpile: https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/desperate-for-medical-equipment-states-encounter-a-beleaguered-national-stockpile/2020/03/28/1f4f9a0a-6f82-11ea-aa80-c2470c6b2034_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/despe...
- al_chemist 6y ago
  > you're not allowed to say anything negative about Donald Trump Have you used Internet or watched American TV in last five years?
  - lisper 6y ago
    Let me be more precise: if you're a Republican politician or a civil servant you are not allowed to say anything negative about Trump and hope to keep your job. If you are a Democratic politician you are not allowed to say anything negative about Trump without risking the loss of federal money and resources that you would otherwise receive. Anyone else is, of course, free to say whatever they want. (For the time being.)
    - AnimalMuppet 6y ago
      I don't know for sure, but I wonder if the Republican governor of a state like Massachusetts feels that way. He might get more votes if he spoke against Trump than if he didn't.
      - lisper 6y ago
        He would lose to a Trump-supported Republican primary challenger.
        AnimalMuppet 6y ago
        He might. Not this year, though - the 2020 Massachusetts primary is history. And four years from now, will Trump care enough to support a primary challenger? Will Republicans care what gubernatorial candidate Trump supports? I mean, I guess if your ambition is to hold office for decades, then you might be concerned. But the downside seems minimal to me. (But then, I'm neither in politics nor in Massachusetts, so what do I know?)

I think this is a polite way of these states saying that they're not going to follow any 'national plan to reopen the economy' put out by the White House.

by mjcl 6y ago

I think this is a polite way of these states saying that they're not going to follow any 'national plan to reopen the economy' put out by the White House.

lisper 6y ago

Exactly right. One of the rules of the game is that you're not allowed to say anything negative about Donald Trump even if (perhaps especially if) it is factually correct. If you do, he will retaliate (by, for example, withholding badly needed aid). So the governors have to speak in code. Listen to Newsome's news conference today and the answer he gave to a reporter about his reaction to Trump's announcement that the decision to re-open the economy is his (Trump's) alone. It's a masterpiece.

rlt 6y ago
> If you do, he will retaliate (by, for example, withholding badly needed aid) Has this actually occurred? I know NY asked for way more ventilators than they got, but as I understood it they were giving them out "just in time" rather than up front in case they were needed more elsewhere.
- aboodman 6y ago
  Yes, it was withheld for several days for Michigan: https://www.metrotimes.com/news-hits/archives/2020/03/28/after-demanding-praise-trump-finally-approves-coronavirus-aid-for-michigan https://www.metrotimes.com/news-hits/archives/2020/03/28/aft...
- jschwartzi 6y ago
  Yes. Early in the outbreak, several of the western states including Washington asked for full FEMA aid but received nothing except some disaster counseling aid, while Florida received huge shipments of medical supplies. Trump as much as said he was waiting for Governor Jay Inslee of Washington to say something nice about him before opening up aid to Washington, which is unconscionable. We seem to be doing just fine here without the Federal Government. In fact we've sent 400 ventilators back to the national stockpile and we also returned the Army hospital that was established at Safeco Field back because we didn't need the capacity. Trump did eventually authorize FEMA to pay for the National Guard response here.
- tmh79 6y ago
  There are also lots of reports of confiscations of PPE: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/06/us/politics/coronavirus-fema-medical-supplies.html https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/06/us/politics/coronavirus-f... https://www.firehouse.com/safety-health/ppe/news/21133559/feds-confiscate-ppe-gowns-from-ma-fire-department-chief-says https://www.firehouse.com/safety-health/ppe/news/21133559/fe... https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/fema-denies-involvement-in-ppe-seizures https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/fema-denies-involvement... I hate to be a conspiracy theorist, but this smells real bad to me. The reports of confiscations are coming from democratic states, not republican states. And it seems like republican lobbyists are getting into the game of distributing PPE: https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/bob-livingston-group-mike-gula-blue-flame-national-governors-association-covid-19-coronavirus-supplies-n95 https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/bob-livingston-group-mike... What it seems to me is happening is a coordinated yet amateurish attempt to restrict the PPE flow to/within democratic states, while allowing the free flow of PPE in republican states. This allows some lobbyists to make money off of it, as well as sticking a finger in the eye of dem leaders (and dying people/healthcare workers in dem states).
  - rlt 6y ago
    > https://www.firehouse.com/safety-health/ppe/news/21133559/feds-confiscate-ppe-gowns-from-ma-fire-department-chief-says https://www.firehouse.com/safety-health/ppe/news/21133559/fe... On the other hand, does the fire department for a town of 27,000 people really need 30,000 gowns, or could those be put to better use elsewhere?
  - jakeogh 6y ago
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1-GrBy67LY http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1-GrBy67LY
- bredren 6y ago
  It isn't only about who it is withheld from, it is who is favored and given to. Florida, where President Trump moved his residence to and who's governor he enjoys a special relationship with, has had greater success than other states in requesting and receiving allocations from the federal stockpile: https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/desperate-for-medical-equipment-states-encounter-a-beleaguered-national-stockpile/2020/03/28/1f4f9a0a-6f82-11ea-aa80-c2470c6b2034_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/despe...
al_chemist 6y ago
> you're not allowed to say anything negative about Donald Trump Have you used Internet or watched American TV in last five years?
- lisper 6y ago
  Let me be more precise: if you're a Republican politician or a civil servant you are not allowed to say anything negative about Trump and hope to keep your job. If you are a Democratic politician you are not allowed to say anything negative about Trump without risking the loss of federal money and resources that you would otherwise receive. Anyone else is, of course, free to say whatever they want. (For the time being.)
  - AnimalMuppet 6y ago
    I don't know for sure, but I wonder if the Republican governor of a state like Massachusetts feels that way. He might get more votes if he spoke against Trump than if he didn't.
    - lisper 6y ago
      He would lose to a Trump-supported Republican primary challenger.
      - AnimalMuppet 6y ago
        He might. Not this year, though - the 2020 Massachusetts primary is history. And four years from now, will Trump care enough to support a primary challenger? Will Republicans care what gubernatorial candidate Trump supports? I mean, I guess if your ambition is to hold office for decades, then you might be concerned. But the downside seems minimal to me. (But then, I'm neither in politics nor in Massachusetts, so what do I know?)