6 ms·

> The US needs to adopt space policies that actually advance science and technology, not manned spaceflight just for feel-good PR shots. I would guess that you

by mb_72 6y ago

> The US needs to adopt space policies that actually advance science and technology, not manned spaceflight just for feel-good PR shots. I would guess that your man-in-the-street can identify much more readily with another human doing 'something' in space than they can some 'robot', even if the latter might be more more productive. And what's wrong with some 'entertainment', not every aspect of life needs to be optimised and tuned for full productivity / efficiency.

TomMarius 6y ago
> not every aspect of life needs to be optimised and tuned for full productivity / efficiency. Eh, this what we're talking about is public money forcefully taken as taxes
- ben_w 6y ago
  One of the criticisms I keep hearing about NASA is that the very thing which made it good in the Space Race era has also been the milestone around its neck ever since — that it is structured as a pork barrel jobs program in each and every state. I have no way to tell how fair that claim is, but I’m sure someone here has either been into space or worked closely enough with NASA to comment. If that’s true, the “waste” is also the advertising that gets the funding for the things which matter. And that’s even ignoring the possibility that the manned missions do the things which can’t be automated.
  - TomMarius 6y ago
    I was talking about efficient usage of public money, not NASA
    - mb_72 6y ago
      NASA's budget is less than half of 1% of the USA total budget (2020 figures from Wikipedia). I daresay there are other areas (cough military spending cough) that would benefit from some examination as to where money can be saved through reduction / efficiencies. BTW I'm not American, but have followed NASA projects for many, many years, and they almost always give me some greater hope for the future of mankind (not to mention admiration for the science and engineering people behind the scenes).
      - TomMarius 6y ago
        Okay, but as I said, I did not talk about NASA at all. I was talking about making sure all public money is used for public benefit and not for entertainment as the OP suggested, because if you're taking money from someone with force "for their benefit", you better not waste it. I don't think what NASA does is wrong, btw. Not an American as well.
        ben_w 6y ago
        Entertainment is a public benefit. Personally, I get nothing from spectator sports, “the great” artists, Shakespeare, opera, nor the majority [0] of musicians. But public funding for soccer or baseball or the Olympics, renaissance art galleries, theatre, and music… these things make most people happy. I don’t empathise with the emotional responses of their respective audiences, but I can acknowledge that to the average Joe, a football is much more than a plastic substitute for an inflated pig bladder. I assume it’s exciting to them in the same way that seeing Chris Hadfield singing in actual space is to me. I don’t get why government funds these things, at least not at a visceral gut level, but the fact that they fund these things indicates that the public has a decent level of support for public funding of entertainment. [0] with the occasional exception.
- joosters 6y ago
  public money forcefully taken as taxes I'm sure that one day, some big event is going to come along that will make Americans appreciate taxpayer-funded services that provide for everybody.
  - tomhoward 6y ago
    The parent's point – though ideologically charged – is that care should be taken to ensure taxes are used for maximum public benefit, rather than being wasted on things that don't benefit the public. The current crisis is a demonstration of why this is important.
    - TomMarius 6y ago
      Thank you. I tried to get ideology out of it.
  - MisterTea 6y ago
    Fear not, all the highly profitable privatized humanitarian aid corporations are lining up as we speak...
    - TomMarius 6y ago
      Like anybody was suggesting anything such. Try to read my comment again.
      - MisterTea 6y ago
        tou-chy. jeez, your ego is that fragile? I mean you downvoted AND replied with some snippy-ass attitude. It's so absurd I actually can't stop laughing right now, thanks.
        TomMarius 6y ago
        I did not downvote you, buddy - I never do, anything. The thing is people like you always come to a comment that is saying something that might be very remotely counter-state (and in this case was not at all), and take it to the extreme. It's not about ego, I just don't think it's any addition to the discussion at all - it's completely off topic. Now I am laughing out very loudly, thank you. :-)

by mb_72 6y ago

TomMarius 6y ago

> not every aspect of life needs to be optimised and tuned for full productivity / efficiency. Eh, this what we're talking about is public money forcefully taken as taxes

ben_w 6y ago
One of the criticisms I keep hearing about NASA is that the very thing which made it good in the Space Race era has also been the milestone around its neck ever since — that it is structured as a pork barrel jobs program in each and every state. I have no way to tell how fair that claim is, but I’m sure someone here has either been into space or worked closely enough with NASA to comment. If that’s true, the “waste” is also the advertising that gets the funding for the things which matter. And that’s even ignoring the possibility that the manned missions do the things which can’t be automated.
- TomMarius 6y ago
  I was talking about efficient usage of public money, not NASA
  - mb_72 6y ago
    NASA's budget is less than half of 1% of the USA total budget (2020 figures from Wikipedia). I daresay there are other areas (cough military spending cough) that would benefit from some examination as to where money can be saved through reduction / efficiencies. BTW I'm not American, but have followed NASA projects for many, many years, and they almost always give me some greater hope for the future of mankind (not to mention admiration for the science and engineering people behind the scenes).
    - TomMarius 6y ago
      Okay, but as I said, I did not talk about NASA at all. I was talking about making sure all public money is used for public benefit and not for entertainment as the OP suggested, because if you're taking money from someone with force "for their benefit", you better not waste it. I don't think what NASA does is wrong, btw. Not an American as well.
      - ben_w 6y ago
        Entertainment is a public benefit. Personally, I get nothing from spectator sports, “the great” artists, Shakespeare, opera, nor the majority [0] of musicians. But public funding for soccer or baseball or the Olympics, renaissance art galleries, theatre, and music… these things make most people happy. I don’t empathise with the emotional responses of their respective audiences, but I can acknowledge that to the average Joe, a football is much more than a plastic substitute for an inflated pig bladder. I assume it’s exciting to them in the same way that seeing Chris Hadfield singing in actual space is to me. I don’t get why government funds these things, at least not at a visceral gut level, but the fact that they fund these things indicates that the public has a decent level of support for public funding of entertainment. [0] with the occasional exception.
joosters 6y ago
public money forcefully taken as taxes I'm sure that one day, some big event is going to come along that will make Americans appreciate taxpayer-funded services that provide for everybody.
- tomhoward 6y ago
  The parent's point – though ideologically charged – is that care should be taken to ensure taxes are used for maximum public benefit, rather than being wasted on things that don't benefit the public. The current crisis is a demonstration of why this is important.
  - TomMarius 6y ago
    Thank you. I tried to get ideology out of it.
- MisterTea 6y ago
  Fear not, all the highly profitable privatized humanitarian aid corporations are lining up as we speak...
  - TomMarius 6y ago
    Like anybody was suggesting anything such. Try to read my comment again.
    - MisterTea 6y ago
      tou-chy. jeez, your ego is that fragile? I mean you downvoted AND replied with some snippy-ass attitude. It's so absurd I actually can't stop laughing right now, thanks.
      - TomMarius 6y ago
        I did not downvote you, buddy - I never do, anything. The thing is people like you always come to a comment that is saying something that might be very remotely counter-state (and in this case was not at all), and take it to the extreme. It's not about ego, I just don't think it's any addition to the discussion at all - it's completely off topic. Now I am laughing out very loudly, thank you. :-)